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Re: [nas] sellin' soccer babes
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kirsten Tautfest" <hori_too@yahoo.com>
To: "US Soccer List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nas] sellin' soccer babes
>
> --- Afusionado <afusionado@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> > Hey! This is about the only topic I've seen in
> > weeks that has woken me from
> > my NAS somnolescence, and you're denigrating it?
> > There are plenty of babes
> > in WUSA too, as evidenced in the playboy poll.
> >
> > Andy
>
> But the point is that they are chosen for their skills
> and not their looks.
>
>
Oh okay, now I see what the issue is... but I thought that the article
regarding Ronaldinha clearly stated that she was one of the best female
fooballers in Europe!And, probably more importantly that her looks, you
don't think that there is anything else going on... like the fact that her
husband plays for Real and Atletico signed her? This is a soccer story, and
a soap opera between two rival clubs, and the fact she's a looker is only a
marginal part of the story. Wait until the first game that Ronaldinha plays
and Ronaldo goes to the stadium to support her (if Real allows him to go!),
then see the pictures that will be on the front pages of the Madrid
newspapers.
To give this a NAS related twist, in general Americans have no clue the
intense rivalries that exist between clubs of the same city, and the lengths
that clubs (and their fans) will go to try to one up each other. This is
just part of that game. In this case one of the greatest rivalries in
Spanish soccer has been devalued due to Atletico's fall from grace into the
2nd division, I am sure they are grasping at straws in order to do anything
they can to draw attention away from their cross city neighbors. Since they
can't even begin to consider contracting Ronaldo, they probably figure they
did the next best thing and are just itching for an opportunity to take
advantage of this one way or another.
Andy
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 09:06:00 2002
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 09:06:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] sellin' soccer babes
To: nas@americakicks.com
In-Reply-To: <004f01c25cd1$15714420$6401a8c0@ANDY>
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--- Afusionado <afusionado@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> >
> Oh okay, now I see what the issue is... but I
> thought that the article
> regarding Ronaldinha clearly stated that she was one
> of the best female
> fooballers in Europe!
Okay, then why isn't she on her National team?
(Brasil?) Will she be seen in the 2003 WWC in China?
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 09:19:49 2002
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From: AbraRob@aol.com
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 12:19:55 EDT
Subject: [nas] OT(sort of): FieldTurf earns praise from NFL players
To: nas@americakicks.com
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With the folks at the NJSEA considering pullling out the natural grass at
Giants Stadium I thought this article would be timely.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2002-09-10-fieldturf_x.htm
And FIFA is more than OK with it:
http://www.fifa2.com/scripts/runisa.dll?M2:gp:822676:67173+find/display+11581+
E
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 12:27:11 2002
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 12:28:41 -0700
Subject: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
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Results from Sept. 17 match
U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1
Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)
US advance to Tournament Final
USSF News link to follow later........
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)</TITLE>
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<BODY>
<FONT SIZE=3D"4"><FONT FACE=3D"Arial">Results from Sept. 17 match <BR>
<BR>
U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1 <BR>
Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)<BR>
<BR>
US advance to Tournament Final<BR>
USSF News link to follow later........</FONT></FONT><FONT SIZE=3D"2"><BR>
</FONT>
</BODY>
</HTML>
--MS_Mac_OE_3114937721_260307_MIME_Part--
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 13:18:49 2002
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To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>, "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
References: <B9AA2D79.8F6%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
Subject: Re: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 15:13:46 -0500
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US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)This is terrific. I can remember not oo long ago =
when the US sides
at youth could not BUY a result! Now they come and we almost expect =
them.
Great win. The Yugos are always a technical bunch.
Jeff
----- Original Message -----=20
From: big_dog@fastmail.fm=20
To: NAS=20
Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 2:28 PM
Subject: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)
Results from Sept. 17 match=20
U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1=20
Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)
US advance to Tournament Final
USSF News link to follow later........
------=_NextPart_000_0056_01C25CCA.7CC48BC0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)</TITLE>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2719.2200" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This is terrific. I can remember not oo =
long ago=20
when the US sides</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>at youth could not BUY a result! =
Now they=20
come and we almost expect them.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Great win. The Yugos are always a =
technical=20
bunch.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Jeff</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3Dbig_dog@fastmail.fm=20
href=3D"mailto:big_dog@fastmail.fm";>big_dog@fastmail.fm</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3DNAS@americakicks.com=20
href=3D"mailto:NAS@americakicks.com";>NAS</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, September 15, =
2002 2:28=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [nas] US U17 v =
Yugoslavia=20
(R)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT size=3D4><FONT face=3DArial>Results from Sept. 17 =
match=20
<BR><BR>U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1 <BR>Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)<BR><BR>US =
advance to=20
Tournament Final<BR>USSF News link to follow =
later........</FONT></FONT><FONT=20
size=3D2><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0056_01C25CCA.7CC48BC0--
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 14:18:14 2002
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From: "Will Sloan" <nyc10sloan@hotmail.com>
To: AbraRob@aol.com, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 17:18:23 -0400
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-Don't forget that almost a month and a half everyone was focused on the
World Cup! So the figures should be even a tad bit better!
>From: AbraRob@aol.com
>To: nas@americakicks.com
>Subject: [nas] MLS Attendance
>Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 11:45:28 EDT
>
>Pretty good weekend should boost attendance close last years totals which
>are
>+2.2% over this years.
>32,874 LA
>17,652 Dal
>19,270 KC
>22,459 Clb
>----------
>92,255 Tot
>----------
>23,064 Avg
>
>Attendance since Sept 5.
> ———————’02———————
>———’01———
>
>LEAG GAMES TOTAL AVG. % CAP. TOTAL AVG.% +/-
>MLS 125 1,934,884 15,479 65.3% 1,978,394 15,827 -2.2%
>
>Hope the table come out in a legible fashion. (if not, copy and paste in
>new
>document and change font to Courier)
>Cheers!
>Roberto.
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 14:58:12 2002
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From: "Alan Balthrop" <alan@kicksfan.com>
To: <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] New-MISL Westermn Division Pre-Season Tournament Final Day (R)
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 16:57:31 -0500
Organization: Dallas Sidekicks Historical Archive
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The new-MISL Western Division pre-season tournament day 2 results:
Kansas City Comets 12 San Diego Sockers 5 (MPS: 24-10)
Dallas Sidekicks 9 Milwaukee Wave 7 (OT) (MPS 18-16 OT)
Final Standings
---------------
1.KC 2-0
2.Dal 1-1
3.Mil 1-1
4.SD 0-2
Alan Balthrop
Webmaster/Historian
Dallas Sidekicks Historical Archive
http://www.kicksfan.com
alan@kicksfan.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 15:16:00 2002
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From: "Phil Schoen" <philsoc@bellsouth.net>
To: <AbraRob@aol.com>,
"NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
Subject: RE: [nas] MLS Attendance
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 18:15:54 -0400
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Has anyone figured out what last years average attendance would have =
been minus Miami and Tampa Bay's home figures? Just curious to see if =
the remaining ten have seen a real increase or if it's just PR...
Phil
---
Phil Schoen
philsoc@bellsouth.net
954.401.4062=20
-----Original Message-----
From: nas-owner@americakicks.com [mailto:nas-owner@americakicks.com]On
Behalf Of AbraRob@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 11:45 AM
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: [nas] MLS Attendance
Pretty good weekend should boost attendance close last years totals =
which are=20
+2.2% over this years.
32,874 LA
17,652 Dal
19,270 KC
22,459 Clb
----------
92,255 Tot
----------
23,064 Avg
=20
Attendance since Sept 5.
=
=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=990=
2=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94 =
=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=9901=E2=80=94=E2=80=94=E2=80=94
=20
LEAG GAMES TOTAL AVG. % CAP. TOTAL AVG.% +/-
MLS 125 1,934,884 15,479 65.3% 1,978,394 15,827 -2.2%
Hope the table come out in a legible fashion. (if not, copy and paste in =
new=20
document and change font to Courier)
Cheers!
Roberto.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 17:21:30 2002
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Subject: [nas] Friedel & Keller today (R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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http://sports.yahoo.com/m/sow/news/ap/20020915/ap-britishrdp.html
http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020915/reu-englandtottenham20
020915.html
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Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 20:45:23 -0500
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Dallas ended up 2.2 %. Don't know about the rest of the league.
But as first mentioned, considering that the league had to play over a month
without the top ten to fifteen players in MLS, as well has having to compete
with the World Cup for audience, I think even breaking even was good. And
maybe the impending WC competition was the straw that broke Miami and Tampa
Bay's back.
----- Original Message -----
From: Phil Schoen <philsoc@bellsouth.net>
To: <AbraRob@aol.com>; NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 5:15 PM
Subject: RE: [nas] MLS Attendance
Has anyone figured out what last years average attendance would have been
minus Miami and Tampa Bay's home figures? Just curious to see if the
remaining ten have seen a real increase or if it's just PR...
Phil
---
Phil Schoen
philsoc@bellsouth.net
954.401.4062
-----Original Message-----
From: nas-owner@americakicks.com [mailto:nas-owner@americakicks.com]On
Behalf Of AbraRob@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 11:45 AM
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: [nas] MLS Attendance
Pretty good weekend should boost attendance close last years totals which
are
+2.2% over this years.
32,874 LA
17,652 Dal
19,270 KC
22,459 Clb
----------
92,255 Tot
----------
23,064 Avg
Attendance since Sept 5.
———————’02——————— ———’01———
LEAG GAMES TOTAL AVG. % CAP. TOTAL AVG.% +/-
MLS 125 1,934,884 15,479 65.3% 1,978,394 15,827 -2.2%
Hope the table come out in a legible fashion. (if not, copy and paste in new
document and change font to Courier)
Cheers!
Roberto.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Sun Sep 15 20:24:05 2002
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 20:24:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
To: nas@americakicks.com
In-Reply-To: <011201c25d22$ba0bc540$3883f6d1@g4y6j4>
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Fire are slightly down, but based on filling up the
stadium . . . This is as far as games to date average
goes. You have to take into account that the first
few games were not even the full stadium layout yet.
Kirsten
--- Kevin Lindstrom <klindstr@flash.net> wrote:
> Dallas ended up 2.2 %. Don't know about the rest of
> the league.
>
> But as first mentioned, considering that the league
> had to play over a month
> without the top ten to fifteen players in MLS, as
> well has having to compete
> with the World Cup for audience, I think even
> breaking even was good. And
> maybe the impending WC competition was the straw
> that broke Miami and Tampa
> Bay's back.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Phil Schoen <philsoc@bellsouth.net>
> To: <AbraRob@aol.com>; NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
> Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 5:15 PM
> Subject: RE: [nas] MLS Attendance
>
>
> Has anyone figured out what last years average
> attendance would have been
> minus Miami and Tampa Bay's home figures? Just
> curious to see if the
> remaining ten have seen a real increase or if it's
> just PR...
>
> Phil
>
> ---
>
> Phil Schoen
> philsoc@bellsouth.net
> 954.401.4062
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nas-owner@americakicks.com
> [mailto:nas-owner@americakicks.com]On
> Behalf Of AbraRob@aol.com
> Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 11:45 AM
> To: nas@americakicks.com
> Subject: [nas] MLS Attendance
>
>
> Pretty good weekend should boost attendance close
> last years totals which
> are
> +2.2% over this years.
> 32,874 LA
> 17,652 Dal
> 19,270 KC
> 22,459 Clb
> ----------
> 92,255 Tot
> ----------
> 23,064 Avg
>
> Attendance since Sept 5.
>
> ———————’02———————
> ———’01———
>
> LEAG GAMES TOTAL AVG. % CAP.
> TOTAL AVG.% +/-
> MLS 125 1,934,884 15,479 65.3% 1,978,394
> 15,827 -2.2%
>
> Hope the table come out in a legible fashion. (if
> not, copy and paste in new
> document and change font to Courier)
> Cheers!
> Roberto.
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks
> (http://www.americakicks.com)
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>
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=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 05:40:05 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
References: <B9A96168.8BB%big_dog@fastmail.fm> <00eb01c25c7c$82166100$3883f6d1@g4y6j4>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS playoff scenario's ?
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 08:39:44 -0400
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As far as the head-to-head (h2h) tiebreakers go at the bottom of the table
Chicago holds the h2h tiebreaker against all the teams it could tie. A
point and they're in. A loss and they're out.
Kansas City holds the h2h tiebreaker against DC & NE. A point and they're
in - DC can't catch them and whatever the outcome of the NE-Metros game,
they are either ahead of the loser or hold the tiebreaker on NE. They can
still get in with a loss if Chicago loses.
DC holds the h2h tiebreaker against only the Metrostars. The only scenario
that gets them into the playoffs is a win against Dallas and losses by both
the Metros and Chicago.
NE holds the h2h tiebreaker against only DC. A win guarantees them a spot.
A loss by Chicago also gets them in. NE can get in with a draw against the
Metros if Chicago doesn't beat Columbus and KC loses.
The Metrostars hold the h2h tiebreaker against KC & NE. A point gets the
Metros in (same situation as KC), but they can sneak in with a loss as long
as two of KC, Chicago, and DC lose.
All this holds true as long as multiple teams don't end up on 35 points
(i.e., a win by DC, a draw by Chicago, a loss by KC, and/or the NE-Metros
game doesn't end in a draw). I have no idea what the tiebreakers are when
more than two teams are tied on points. (This is also all based on the
understanding that the h2h tiebreakers are record against each other
followed by the entire season's goal differential. I haven't seen this in
writing, but have inferred it from previous MLSnet articles.)
Keith
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kevin Lindstrom" <klindstr@flash.net>
> Behind Dallas is where the craziness begins.
>
> New England and Metro can catch Columbus currently, and the Crew now go to
> Chicago with the Fire playing for their lives -- so Columbus does not
> necessarily have the East locked up. Unfortunately for the Fire, they
have
> yet to really get on any sort of rhythm and have struggled at home.
>
> Currently, the points are as follows: NY/NJ, City and New England at 35,
> Chicago at 34 and DC at 32. Remaining games are as follows: DC v. Dallas,
> LA @ San Jose, Columbus @ Chicago, City @ Colorado, NY/NJ @ the Rev.
>
> Needless to say, if United loses, they are out. Win, and they probably
> still need some help since they would only be ahead of Chicago on points
and
> would have the tie-breaker on NY/NJ before those two play. Both would
have
> to falter. Considering how Dallas has been playing and the calls from the
> refs (funny how both teams playing against Eastern Conference teams
outside
> the playoffs ended up with two red cards each, huh?) there is a fair to
good
> chance United actually pulls off the win.
>
> Beyond that is plain craziness. Of the other teams, most are win and they
> are in. Certainly all of the teams at 35 points are in that place, except
> that two (Metro and the Rev) play each other and both cannot win --
although
> they could tie and both might still make the playoffs.
>
> City will have it tough since the Rapids will be playing at home and
wanting
> to ensure that they get HFA in the first round. It is mathematically
> possible for them to lose out (same for all of the 35 point teams if they
> don't get a point in their last game) and it might come down to
tie-breakers
> (which I do not have -- anyone have that breakdown?)
>
> Bottom line, looks like this (in order of likelihood, imho) -- No. 1
LA/SJ,
> No. 2 Columbus, No. 3 SJ/LA, No. 4 Colorado, No. 5 Dallas, No. 6 New
> England, No. 7-10 depending on tie-breakers (I think Chicago will tie the
> Crew, DC will win and the Rev will win, leaving KC, Chicago, DC and Metro
> all at 35 points).
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 06:54:11 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
References: <B9A9E7EA.8D5%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
Subject: Re: [nas] Who will win the MLS Cup this year ?
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 09:53:49 -0400
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I noticed on the poll that you referred to DC United as Washington and the
Metrostars as New York. It got me thinking about what we call the teams.
Every team except these two have a nice easy city name attached to their
names. But what do fans of DC United and the Metrostars prefer? What do
fans of other teams like to call these two (other than Metroscum,
Rotmasters, etc.)
Personally, as a DCU season ticket holder, calling the team Washington
annoys me a bit; why I don't know. (I even changed the name of the team in
Championship Manager from Washington).
----- Original Message -----
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
> Please vote at:
> http://www.sams-army.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 07:10:09 2002
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From: "Chris Allen" <csallen@charter.net>
Organization: Political Science/University of Georgia
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 10:10:37 -0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS playoff scenarios ?
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On 16 Sep 2002 at 8:39, Keith Bundy wrote:
> As far as the head-to-head (h2h) tiebreakers go at the bottom of the
> table
[multiple paragraphs of arcania deleted]
First, New England does have the H2H advantage vs Columbus. So
if Columbus loses and the Revs win, the Revs are Eastern Division
Champions! (strange as that truly seems).
But don't you guys wish this could be a little easier?
It can. If the league would do what most other leagues do, namely
the tiebreakers are:
1. Points
2. Goal Difference
3. Goals Scored
After that, flip a coin.
Right now, the 3 teams at 35 (Revs, Metros, Wiz) would be ranked
in that order since the Revs have a better GD than the Wiz (-3 vs -
8), and have a better goals scored than the Metros (45 vs 41).
The beauty of this system is that the numbers are right there in front
of you in the standings and you don't need a team of lawyers or
mathmaticians to figure it out.
Pd W D L GD G+ G- Pts
1. Los Angeles Galaxy 27 15 3 9 +10 43 - 33 48
2. San Jose Earthquakes 27 14 3 10 +11 45 - 34 45
3. Colorado Rapids 27 13 3 11 -5 42 - 47 42
4. Dallas Burn 27 11 7 9 -1 39 - 40 40
5. Columbus Crew 27 11 5 11 +2 43 - 41 38
6. New England Revolution 27 11 2 14 -3 45 - 48 35
7. MetroStars 27 11 2 14 -3 41 - 44 35
8. Kansas City Wizards 27 9 8 10 -8 36 - 44 35
9. Chicago Fire 27 10 4 13 +5 40 - 35 34
10. DC United 27 9 5 13 -8 28 - 36 32
Why the mania over head to head? First, not everyone has played
each other the same number of games. Second, isn't the point of
the entire season to see how well you do against the entire league
and not just the one team you happen to share points with on the
last day?
Inquiring minds....
Chris Allen
csallen@charter.net
http://webpages.charter.net/csallen/soccer.htm
-
"Comrades, we always said it was a 5 year plan"
--NE Rev Fanzine "Pictures of Chairman Mao (1996-2001)
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 07:24:46 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
References: <3D85AE1D.5922.2416AE@localhost>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS playoff scenarios ?
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 10:24:22 -0400
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I went over head-to-head tiebreakers because that's what MLS seems to be
using as the first tiebreaker between two teams tied on points. I too would
prefer goal difference be used (except that the two teams I support, KC &
DC, have horrible GD).
Does anyone recall what tiebreakers were used in years past? Where did MLS
come up with head-to-head? Is that what the NFL uses? What does the NBA
do?
Curious...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Allen" <csallen@charter.net>
> Why the mania over head to head? First, not everyone has played
> each other the same number of games. Second, isn't the point of
> the entire season to see how well you do against the entire league
> and not just the one team you happen to share points with on the
> last day?
>
> Inquiring minds....
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 07:31:59 2002
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Subject: [nas] THE Washingtoin/DCU fans
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Got to watch the seconf DCU/Metro's match on tape yesterday. Fantastic
showing by the DCU fans, banners all around the rim of the stadium, the
bouncing bleachers like never before, etc.. I was just very impressed!
BD
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Subject: [nas] Seattle v Portland A-League (Series R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Vancuver sends Regular season leaders packing
http://www.soccer365.com/US_home/United_Soccer_Leagues/page_28_39130.shtml
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 08:07:48 -0700
Subject: [nas] Resource: State referee administrator directory
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9AB41D4.946%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
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State Referee Administrator E-Mail Address Directory
9/13/02 10:51 AM
CHICAGO (Friday, September 13, 2002) - The following is a list of State
Association administrators. Corrections to this information should be
e-mailed to Carol McGuire at cmcguire@ussoccer.org providing the information
as shown below. Corrections to names on this list will be accepted only from
the chair of the State Referee Committee or the SRA. Corrections to e-mail
addresses will be accepted from the individuals concerned.
PDF file:
http://www.ussoccer.com/templates/includes/services/referees/pdfs/sept02_adm
in.PDF
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Resource: State referee administrator directory</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<FONT COLOR=3D"#00226C"><H3>State Referee Administrator E-Mail Address Direct=
ory<BR>
</H3></FONT><FONT COLOR=3D"#CB0A0B"><FONT SIZE=3D"2">9/13/02 10:51 AM<BR>
</FONT></FONT><FONT SIZE=3D"4">CHICAGO (Friday, September 13, 2002) - The fol=
lowing is a list of State Association administrators. Corrections to this in=
formation should be e-mailed to Carol McGuire at <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF">cmcgu=
ire@ussoccer.org</FONT> providing the information as shown below. Correction=
s to names on this list will be accepted only from the chair of the State Re=
feree Committee or the SRA. Corrections to e-mail addresses will be accepted=
from the individuals concerned.<BR>
</FONT>PDF file:<BR>
http://www.ussoccer.com/templates/includes/services/referees/pdfs/sept02_ad=
min.PDF
</BODY>
</HTML>
--MS_Mac_OE_3115008468_190389_MIME_Part--
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 08:12:35 -0700
From: Jay Hipps <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>
Subject: [nas] MLS Match Reports up at CSN
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Hi folks --
The new crop of MLS Match reports, as well as a couple more features,
are now up at CSN.
http://www.cybersoccernews.com/
Jay
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 08:25:39 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 08:26:57 -0700
Subject: [nas] MLS Newslinks 09/14-16 (38 articles)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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MLS hit parade (goal video downloads)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/goals0915.html
Rules in review: Passive offside and involvement
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0913offside.html
MLS newsstand 09-16 (6)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0916newsstand.html
MLS Newsstand 09-15 (17)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0915newsstand.html
MLS Newsstand 09-14 (13)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0914newsstand.html
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 08:52:09 2002
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Subject: [nas] Updated A-League playoff bracket
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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http://a-league.com/2002playoffs.shtml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 09:48:15 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 12:46:42 -0400
From: Matt Bernhardt <bernhardt.7@osu.edu>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
To: nas@americakicks.com
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Ask and ye shall receive Phil...
2001 Average Attendance without Florida teams:
15,841
YTD Average for 2002: 15,656 (1.2% decrease)
There are 5 games left this season - in order for the league to match
last season's attendance average, we need 104,155 fans to attend those 5
games (20,831 per game). Given that Chicago taps out around 16,000
(otherwise they'd probably get more than 20K easily), the other 4 games
need 22,038 each.
Matt
Phil Schoen wrote:
> Has anyone figured out what last years average attendance would have been minus Miami and Tampa Bay's home figures? Just curious to see if the remaining ten have seen a real increase or if it's just PR...
>
> Phil
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 10:13:11 2002
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Reply-To: <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
From: "Timothy D. Ristorcelli" <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US Soccer News Links 09-16-02
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 13:13:48 -0400
Message-ID: <NFBBIPKNNAKPKDLEMCLEKEBDCDAA.crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
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US Soccer News Links 09-16-02
http://www.sams-army.com/index.php/Mlist=news/Nyear=2002/Nmonth=09/Nday=16
____________________________________
Timothy D. Ristorcelli, MBA
crazo@tampabay.rr.com
Check out: http://www.sams-army.com
ICQ: 1361610
____________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 11:36:16 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 11:36:20 -0700 (PDT)
From: Sam Pierron <pnkfreud@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
To: nas@americakicks.com
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--- Matt Bernhardt <bernhardt.7@osu.edu> wrote:
> Ask and ye shall receive Phil...
>
> 2001 Average Attendance without Florida teams:
> 15,841
>
> YTD Average for 2002: 15,656 (1.2% decrease)
Okay, but when you consider the lost attendance in
Chicago, it all evens out.
=====
Sam Pierron
Home phone: 785-841-8127
Cell phone: 785-218-3636
AIM: sampierron
"I think MLS has given some of our players the courage to score goals."
--Jeff Bradley, espn.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 13:38:47 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 13:38:10 -0700
Subject: Re: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9AB8F42.996%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
In-Reply-To: <B9AA2D79.8F6%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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> This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
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http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=22086&itype=
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 12:28:41 -0700
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)
Results from Sept. 17 match
U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1
Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)
US advance to Tournament Final
USSF News link to follow later........
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: [nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=3D22086&itype=3D<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<B>From: </B><big_dog@fastmail.fm><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Sun, 15 Sep 2002 12:28:41 -0700<BR>
<B>To: </B>NAS <NAS@americakicks.com><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>[nas] US U17 v Yugoslavia (R)<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"4"><FONT FACE=3D"Arial">Results from Sept. 17 match <=
BR>
<BR>
U.S. 2, Yugoslavia 1 <BR>
Memo 1, Gaven 1, (Ashe)<BR>
<BR>
US advance to Tournament Final<BR>
USSF News link to follow later........<BR>
</FONT></FONT><BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</BODY>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 13:45:48 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 13:46:48 -0700
Subject: [nas] Top US youth teams to play in London Cup
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9AB9148.998%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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An announcement from US Club on top US Youth teams participating in the
London Cup, against youth teams from the EPL, Real Madrid, Feyenoord, and
others.
See
http://www.usclubsoccer.com/news/index.cfm?n=28
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<FONT SIZE=3D"4"><FONT FACE=3D"Arial">An announcement from US Club on top US Yo=
uth teams participating in the London Cup, against youth teams from the EPL,=
Real Madrid, Feyenoord, and others. <BR>
See <BR>
</FONT></FONT>http://www.usclubsoccer.com/news/index.cfm?n=3D28
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 14:26:48 2002
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From: "nsa" <nsa@charter.net>
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
References: <B9AB41D4.946%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
Subject: Re: [nas] Resource: State referee administrator directory
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:50:26 -0400
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FYI. The Massachusetts information is not up-to-date.
I have forwarded this to our SRA so that he can get the correct info to
National.
-nat
----- Original Message -----
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: "NAS" <NAS@americakicks.com>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 11:07
Subject: [nas] Resource: State referee administrator directory
State Referee Administrator E-Mail Address Directory
9/13/02 10:51 AM
CHICAGO (Friday, September 13, 2002) - The following is a list of State
Association administrators. Corrections to this information should be
e-mailed to Carol McGuire at cmcguire@ussoccer.org providing the information
as shown below. Corrections to names on this list will be accepted only from
the chair of the State Referee Committee or the SRA. Corrections to e-mail
addresses will be accepted from the individuals concerned.
PDF file:
http://www.ussoccer.com/templates/includes/services/referees/pdfs/sept02_adm
in.PDF
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 14:30:02 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 14:30:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: [nas] Fwd: Bryan Namoff: A Soccer Odyssey
To: nas@americakicks.com
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--- Aureliano Narro <aureliano@ms1.ngti.com> wrote:
> Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 12:23:41 -0400
> From: "Aureliano Narro" <aureliano@ms1.ngti.com>
> To: <tcsresponses@yahoo.com>
> Subject: Bryan Namoff: A Soccer Odyssey
>
> In the latest installment of soccer's iron-man
> competition, Bryan took the field on four
> consecutive nights in four different stadiums. He
> was playing in games of significance for DC United
> and the Richmond Kickers. Match reports follow:
>
> 09/12/2002-Medowlands, NJ
>
http://www.dcunited.com/index.cfm?section=main&cont_id=128663
> 09/13/2002-Charleston, SC
>
http://www.charlestonbattery.com/matches_report.asp?mid=55
> 09/14/2002-Washington, DC
>
http://www.dcunited.com/index.cfm?section=main&cont_id=129297
> 09/15/2002 Richmond, VA
>
http://www.richmondkickers.com/news/0915002Batterygamesum.htm
>
> Congratulations Bryan on a successfull weekend!
>
> Sincerely,
> Aureliano Narro
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 14:33:20 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 14:33:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Attendance
To: nas@americakicks.com
In-Reply-To: <3D860AF2.2040806@osu.edu>
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Make that 15K for Chicago.
We can squeeze more into Section 8 but were told no
after the seats were supposedly left bent. :(
--- Matt Bernhardt <bernhardt.7@osu.edu> wrote:
> Ask and ye shall receive Phil...
>
> 2001 Average Attendance without Florida teams:
> 15,841
>
> YTD Average for 2002: 15,656 (1.2% decrease)
>
> There are 5 games left this season - in order for
> the league to match
> last season's attendance average, we need 104,155
> fans to attend those 5
> games (20,831 per game). Given that Chicago taps out
> around 16,000
> (otherwise they'd probably get more than 20K
> easily), the other 4 games
> need 22,038 each.
>
> Matt
>
> Phil Schoen wrote:
>
> > Has anyone figured out what last years average
> attendance would have been minus Miami and Tampa
> Bay's home figures? Just curious to see if the
> remaining ten have seen a real increase or if it's
> just PR...
> >
> > Phil
>
>
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks
> (http://www.americakicks.com)
> To subscribe or unsubscribe:
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> To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 14:41:17 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 14:41:25 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
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I would like to hear any comments on this list about
Mathis' behavior on the pitch that resulted in (and
well deserved, imho) a stright red card.
Do you think that this will be reviewed by the MLS and
his punishment extended? If so, for how long? He is
certainly out for the final regular season match, but
could be suspended for playoffs all or part.
I think they should throw the book at 'em and at least
for remainder of the post-season. I don't want to see
the MLS just give him a slap on the wrist just because
he's a star. It sets a bad example for the youth of
america et al who look up to him.
Kirsten
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
References: <20020916214125.53608.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:45:44 -0400
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I didn't see the actual step, but my wife did. She said she couldn't
believe that Mathis had really just done that. I can't imagine anything
less than two additional games. (Isn't that what Zidane got - a total of
three games - for his raking of the Saudi player in '98?)
Keith
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kirsten Tautfest" <hori_too@yahoo.com>
> I would like to hear any comments on this list about
> Mathis' behavior on the pitch that resulted in (and
> well deserved, imho) a stright red card.
>
> Do you think that this will be reviewed by the MLS and
> his punishment extended? If so, for how long? He is
> certainly out for the final regular season match, but
> could be suspended for playoffs all or part.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 14:55:27 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:55:27 -0400
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
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In a message dated Mon, 16 Sep 2002 4:41:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, hori_too@yahoo.com writes:
> I would like to hear any comments on this list about
> Mathis' behavior on the pitch that resulted in (and
> well deserved, imho) a stright red card.
>
Please provide a description of what happened.
Ed
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:29:45 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:29:46 -0700
From: Jay Hipps <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
In-reply-to: <00e401c25dca$6b4d4c00$1910a8c0@wsadmin1>
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Remember what Diego Serna did to Nick Garcia last year? I don't think
he missed any playoff games from that. (He punched him with an open
palm on a corner. Left Garcia a bloody, dazed mess.)
On Monday, September 16, 2002, at 02:45 PM, Keith Bundy wrote:
> I didn't see the actual step, but my wife did. She said she couldn't
> believe that Mathis had really just done that. I can't imagine
> anything
> less than two additional games. (Isn't that what Zidane got - a total
> of
> three games - for his raking of the Saudi player in '98?)
>
> Keith
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kirsten Tautfest" <hori_too@yahoo.com>
>
>
>> I would like to hear any comments on this list about
>> Mathis' behavior on the pitch that resulted in (and
>> well deserved, imho) a stright red card.
>>
>> Do you think that this will be reviewed by the MLS and
>> his punishment extended? If so, for how long? He is
>> certainly out for the final regular season match, but
>> could be suspended for playoffs all or part.
>
>
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www.americakicks.com)
> To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com
> To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:31:39 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:33:06 -0700
Subject: [nas] FSW soccer programming this week
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Tuesday 9.17
Brazilian Soccer Guarani v Corinthians 5:00 pm ET
Scottish Soccer 11:00 pm ET
Wednesday 9.18
Premier League Leeds Utd. v Manchester Utd. 8:00 pm ET
Thursday 9.19
Brazilian Soccer Vasco v Santos 2:00 am ET
UEFA Cup Celta Vigo v Odense 3:30 pm ET (LIVE)
Saturday 9.21
German Soccer 9:30 am ET (LIVE)
Sunday 9.22
German Soccer 11:30 am ET (LIVE)
Premier League 2:00 pm ET
Argentine Soccer Independiente v River Plate 6:00 pm ET
Monday 9.23
Premier League Fulham v Chelsea 3:00 pm ET (LIVE)
Scottish Soccer Rangers v Partick Thistle 8:00 pm ET
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>FSW soccer programming this week</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<FONT FACE=3D"Arial"><H4>Tuesday 9.17<BR>
</H4>Brazilian Soccer Guarani v Corinthians 5:00 pm ET<BR=
>
Scottish Soccer 11:00 pm ET<BR>
<H4>Wednesday 9.18<BR>
</H4>Premier League Leeds Utd. v Manchester Utd. 8:00 pm =
ET <BR>
<H4>Thursday 9.19<BR>
</H4>Brazilian Soccer Vasco v Santos 2:00 am ET<BR>
UEFA Cup Celta Vigo v Odense 3:30 pm ET (LIVE)<BR>
<H4>Saturday 9.21<BR>
</H4>German Soccer 9:30 am ET (LIVE)<BR>
<H4>Sunday 9.22<BR>
</H4>German Soccer 11:30 am ET (LIVE)<BR>
Premier League 2:00 pm ET<BR>
Argentine Soccer Independiente v River Plate 6:00 pm ET<B=
R>
<H4>Monday 9.23<BR>
</H4>Premier League Fulham v Chelsea 3:00 pm ET (LIVE)<BR=
>
Scottish Soccer Rangers v Partick Thistle 8:00 pm ET</FON=
T>
</BODY>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:32:37 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:33:54 -0700
Subject: [nas] Over There (Yanks Abroad) 09-16
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9ABAA62.9B3%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Cherundolo and Hannover knock off Leverkusen
http://66.221.11.74/overthere/020916mon.shtml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:35:33 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 18:32:27 -0400
To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>,NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] FSW soccer programming this week
In-Reply-To: <B9ABAA31.9B1%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Thanks -
Anyone know who ESPN are showing for the Champions League tommorow?
Liverpool vs Valencia perhaps?
Fox Sports (Regular Cable) also have a lot of EPL highlights this week. I
must say, I like their new highlights show (Sunday's 10pm, Monday's 12pm).
So long Lionel.
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
At 03:33 PM 9/16/02 -0700, big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
>Tuesday 9.17
>
>
>Brazilian Soccer Guarani v Corinthians 5:00 pm ET
>Scottish Soccer 11:00 pm ET
>
>
>Wednesday 9.18
>
>
>Premier League Leeds Utd. v Manchester Utd. 8:00 pm ET
>
>
>Thursday 9.19
>
>
>Brazilian Soccer Vasco v Santos 2:00 am ET
>UEFA Cup Celta Vigo v Odense 3:30 pm ET (LIVE)
>
>
>Saturday 9.21
>
>
>German Soccer 9:30 am ET (LIVE)
>
>
>Sunday 9.22
>
>
>German Soccer 11:30 am ET (LIVE)
>Premier League 2:00 pm ET
>Argentine Soccer Independiente v River Plate 6:00 pm ET
>
>
>Monday 9.23
>
>
>Premier League Fulham v Chelsea 3:00 pm ET (LIVE)
>Scottish Soccer Rangers v Partick Thistle 8:00 pm ET
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Reply-To: <fauss@rt.com>
From: "Jason Fauss" <jfauss@earthlink.net>
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] Champions League Tomorrow [OT]
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:42:09 -0500
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AS Roma vs. Real Madrid
Some controversy over Ronaldo's signing:
http://www.soccernet.com/championsleague/news/2002/0906/20020906ronaldod
eadline.html
-----Original Message-----
Anyone know who ESPN are showing for the Champions League tommorow?
Liverpool vs Valencia perhaps?
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:48:31 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:49:52 -0700
Subject: Re: [nas] Champions League Tomorrow [OT]
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: North American Soccer Mailing List <nas@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9ABAE20.9BA%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Sep. 17 UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE
AS ROMA VS. REAL MADRID CF
STADIO OLIMPICO (ROMA AND LAZIO) ROME, ITALY 2:30 pm to
4:45 pm
From: "Jason Fauss" <jfauss@earthlink.net>
Reply-To: <fauss@rt.com>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:42:09 -0500
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] Champions League Tomorrow [OT]
AS Roma vs. Real Madrid
Some controversy over Ronaldo's signing:
http://www.soccernet.com/championsleague/news/2002/0906/20020906ronaldod
eadline.html
-----Original Message-----
Anyone know who ESPN are showing for the Champions League tommorow?
Liverpool vs Valencia perhaps?
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<BODY>
<FONT SIZE=3D"2">Sep. 17<B> UEFA CHAMPIONS LEAGUE<BR>
</B>AS ROMA VS. REAL MADRID CF<BR>
STADIO OLIMPICO (ROMA AND LAZIO) ROME, ITALY<B> 2:30 pm t=
o<BR>
</B></FONT><H5>4:45 pm<BR>
</H5><BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<B>From: </B>"Jason Fauss" <jfauss@earthlink.net><BR>
<B>Reply-To: </B><fauss@rt.com><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:42:09 -0500<BR>
<B>To: </B>"North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americaki=
cks.com><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>[nas] Champions League Tomorrow [OT]<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><TT>AS Roma vs. Real Madrid<BR>
<BR>
Some controversy over Ronaldo's signing:<BR>
<BR>
http://www.soccernet.com/championsleague/news/2002/0906/20020906ronaldod<BR=
>
eadline.html<BR>
<BR>
-----Original Message-----<BR>
<BR>
Anyone know who ESPN are showing for the Champions League tommorow?<BR>
<BR>
Liverpool vs Valencia perhaps?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 15:58:44 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 18:55:30 -0400
To: <fauss@rt.com>,
"North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Champions League Tomorrow [OT]
In-Reply-To: <010101c25dd2$4e09b6d0$630586a5@sfaussja>
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Cheers Jason and Big Dog.
Should be a good game. Replay of the Giants stadium game eh?
At 05:42 PM 9/16/02 -0500, Jason Fauss wrote:
>AS Roma vs. Real Madrid
>
>Some controversy over Ronaldo's signing:
>
>http://www.soccernet.com/championsleague/news/2002/0906/20020906ronaldod
>eadline.html
>
>-----Original Message-----
>
>Anyone know who ESPN are showing for the Champions League tommorow?
>
>Liverpool vs Valencia perhaps?
>
>
>---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:17:29 2002
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From: "mike boettge" <popeye_mb@hotmail.com>
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: [nas] OT--2002 Laws of the Game, a question
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 00:17:28 +0000
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I was watching Blackburn/City today and I swear I saw the ref back the
defending team 10 yards closer to their goal on a free kick after they had
protested/lingered on the initial call. Now this is a change to the laws
that I have heard debated for years, similar to the existing law in rugby.
My crappy old computer cannot open the PDF file at FIFA.com and I have tried
for the last half-hour or so to find a copy of the latest laws in text form
that I can read and cannot. One site had the 1998 laws as their current
version. So I need some help here :]
1)Anybody else heard about this change or saw a similar play this season?
2)Anybody know if it's just an 'experiment' only for the EPL?
3)Anybody can send me a plain text version of the 2002/3 laws?
Sorry for the selfish intrusion. I used to be on a Referee mailing list but
had to quit because I was getting 30 Emails a day on such timeless,
resolvable issues as "Who's worse, parents or coaches?" or "Would the play
be offside if......(fill in the most unimaginable, un-gamelike situation
possible)?"
Thanks,
MikeB,StL,Mo
USA! USA! USA!
Forza Milan
Evertonia!
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:23:17 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 20:20:00 -0400
To: "mike boettge" <popeye_mb@hotmail.com>,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] OT--2002 Laws of the Game, a question
In-Reply-To: <F4vhXt98JiIHljP1AK8000068b7@hotmail.com>
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Mike,
My understanding is that this came in last year. I have seen it applied
once or twice since then. My knowledge of it is very vague, but I
understand it to mean that the Referee has a right to punish excessive
protestations and gamesmanship with a yardage penalty.
Cheers
Niall Swan
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
At 12:17 AM 9/17/02 +0000, you wrote:
>I was watching Blackburn/City today and I swear I saw the ref back the
>defending team 10 yards closer to their goal on a free kick after they had
>protested/lingered on the initial call. Now this is a change to the laws
>that I have heard debated for years, similar to the existing law in rugby.
>My crappy old computer cannot open the PDF file at FIFA.com and I have
>tried for the last half-hour or so to find a copy of the latest laws in
>text form that I can read and cannot. One site had the 1998 laws as their
>current version. So I need some help here :]
>
>1)Anybody else heard about this change or saw a similar play this season?
>2)Anybody know if it's just an 'experiment' only for the EPL?
>3)Anybody can send me a plain text version of the 2002/3 laws?
>
>Sorry for the selfish intrusion. I used to be on a Referee mailing list
>but had to quit because I was getting 30 Emails a day on such timeless,
>resolvable issues as "Who's worse, parents or coaches?" or "Would the play
>be offside if......(fill in the most unimaginable, un-gamelike situation
>possible)?"
>Thanks,
>MikeB,StL,Mo
>USA! USA! USA!
>Forza Milan
>Evertonia!
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
>http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:26:29 2002
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From: "mike boettge" <popeye_mb@hotmail.com>
To: kdaleb@wsu.edu, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 00:26:38 +0000
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>From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
(Isn't that what Zidane got - a total of
>three games - for his raking of the Saudi player in '98?)
>
Yes. He was ejected and then had to sit out the next two games besides. And
he didn't really even rake the guy. He just put a little extra downward
pressure on as leapt over the guy on the ground. Just kinda stepped on him
when he really didn't need to. I had to see it in slo-mo to really pick it
up. Very sharp referee.
I didn't see the Mathis incident though. I was watching Dallas/NE.
MikeB,StL,Mo
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:46:08 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 20:44:55 -0400
From: Bill Faucett <bfaucett@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
To: Keith Bundy <kdaleb@wsu.edu>,
North American Soccer Mailing List <nas@americakicks.com>
Reply-to: Bill Faucett <bfaucett@comcast.net>
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Dumb move by Mathis. He has to think before he does that because his team
needs him out on the field. He also needs to be aware of who the referee is.
Kevin Stott is quick with the red card, anything close there and Mathis sees
red.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
> I didn't see the actual step, but my wife did. She said she couldn't
> believe that Mathis had really just done that. I can't imagine anything
> less than two additional games. (Isn't that what Zidane got - a total of
> three games - for his raking of the Saudi player in '98?)
>
> Keith
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kirsten Tautfest" <hori_too@yahoo.com>
>
>
> > I would like to hear any comments on this list about
> > Mathis' behavior on the pitch that resulted in (and
> > well deserved, imho) a stright red card.
> >
> > Do you think that this will be reviewed by the MLS and
> > his punishment extended? If so, for how long? He is
> > certainly out for the final regular season match, but
> > could be suspended for playoffs all or part.
>
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:48:59 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 20:47:20 -0400
From: Bill Faucett <bfaucett@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [nas] OT--2002 Laws of the Game, a question
To: nas@americakicks.com
Reply-to: Bill Faucett <bfaucett@comcast.net>
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Fifa has authorized an experiment on this in the EPL only. This is NOT part
of the laws. The results last year were mixed. I didn't know they were still
doing this, but it is something that has a chance to make it into the laws
at some point if the experiment in England is successful.
Bill
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike boettge" <popeye_mb@hotmail.com>
To: <nas@americakicks.com>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 8:17 PM
Subject: [nas] OT--2002 Laws of the Game, a question
> I was watching Blackburn/City today and I swear I saw the ref back the
> defending team 10 yards closer to their goal on a free kick after they had
> protested/lingered on the initial call. Now this is a change to the laws
> that I have heard debated for years, similar to the existing law in rugby.
> My crappy old computer cannot open the PDF file at FIFA.com and I have
tried
> for the last half-hour or so to find a copy of the latest laws in text
form
> that I can read and cannot. One site had the 1998 laws as their current
> version. So I need some help here :]
>
> 1)Anybody else heard about this change or saw a similar play this season?
> 2)Anybody know if it's just an 'experiment' only for the EPL?
> 3)Anybody can send me a plain text version of the 2002/3 laws?
>
> Sorry for the selfish intrusion. I used to be on a Referee mailing list
but
> had to quit because I was getting 30 Emails a day on such timeless,
> resolvable issues as "Who's worse, parents or coaches?" or "Would the play
> be offside if......(fill in the most unimaginable, un-gamelike situation
> possible)?"
> Thanks,
> MikeB,StL,Mo
> USA! USA! USA!
> Forza Milan
> Evertonia!
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
> http://www.hotmail.com
>
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www.americakicks.com)
> To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com
> To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 17:54:22 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:55:43 -0700
Subject: [nas] US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Uruguay 2 US U17's 0
-----
http://www.futbol.com.uy/mvdnews/hnnoticiaj1.cgi?936,0,0,20020916
Uruguay the Convincing Champion!
Header
The Uruguay U-17 Team left with the International Friendly Tournament Title
that recently took place in Italy, after overcoming the other finalist
United States by a score of 2-0. The winning goals were converted in the
first half by Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra.
This is a notable accomplishment for the Uruguay U-17 squed that is
currently preparing for the South American championship to take place next
year in Venezuela
Directed by "Polilla" Da Silva, they won 2-0 in the tournament final against
the United States through the goals of Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra in
the first half, a game played in the city of Gaeta's stadium.
Uruguay finished a great tournament once they consecrated it as champions in
convincing form. It is noteworthy to remember that in the tournament's first
phase Uruguay beat the local Italian squad through penalties after
equalizing the game 1-1 in regular time, then the Czech Republic (3-1),
Ireland (3-0), and then won the final against the United States (2-0).
The Baby Blue Delegation will be arriving in our country the 18th,
Wednesday, at 10:30 in the morning at the Internacional de Carrasco Airport.
--MS_Mac_OE_3115043743_2312092_MIME_Part
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BLOCKQUOTE>Uruguay 2 US U17's 0<BR>
-----<BR>
http://www.futbol.com.uy/mvdnews/hnnoticiaj1.cgi?936,0,0,20020916<BR>
<BR>
<FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=3D"5"><FONT FACE=3D"Arial">Uruguay the Convinc=
ing Champion!</FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT FACE=3D"Arial"><FONT SIZE=3D"4"> <BR>
<BR>
<I>Header</I> <BR>
<B>The Uruguay U-17 Team left with the International Friendly Tournament Ti=
tle that recently took place in Italy, after overcoming the other finalist U=
nited States by a score of 2-0. The winning goals were converted in the firs=
t half by Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra.</B> <BR>
<BR>
This is a notable accomplishment for the Uruguay U-17 squed that is current=
ly preparing for the South American championship to take place next year in =
Venezuela <BR>
<BR>
Directed by "Polilla" Da Silva, they won 2-0 in the tournament fi=
nal against the United States through the goals of Juan Albin and Ivan de la=
Sierra in the first half, a game played in the city of Gaeta's stadium. <BR=
>
<BR>
Uruguay finished a great tournament once they consecrated it as champions i=
n convincing form. It is noteworthy to remember that in the tournament's fir=
st phase Uruguay beat the local Italian squad through penalties after equali=
zing the game 1-1 in regular time, then the Czech Republic (3-1), Ireland (3=
-0), and then won the final against the United States (2-0). <BR>
<BR>
The Baby Blue Delegation will be arriving in our country the 18th, Wednesda=
y, at 10:30 in the morning at the Internacional de Carrasco Airport.<BR>
</FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"2"><BR>
</FONT><BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</BODY>
</HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 19:46:19 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 19:46:14 -0700
From: Jay Hipps <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>
Subject: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
In-reply-to: <20020916214125.53608.qmail@web11906.mail.yahoo.com>
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Somebody at MLS spent a lot of time putting this together...
--
MLS Cup Playoff Reset - Sunday, Sept. 15, 2002
MAX
SD TEAM GP REC PTS G+/- PTS Remaining
Game
1. X *Los Angeles Galaxy 27 15-9-3 48 +10 51
@ SJ on Saturday
2. X *Columbus Crew 27 11-11-5 38 +2 41 @
CHI on Sunday
3. X San Jose Earthquakes 27 14-10-3 45 +11 48
vs. LA on Saturday
4. X Colorado Rapids 27 13-11-3 42 -5 45 vs.
KC on Friday
5. X Dallas Burn 27 11-9-7 40 0 43 @ DC
on Thursday
6. MetroStars 27 11-14-2 35 -3 38 @ NE
on Saturday
7. Kansas City Wizards 27 9-10-8 35 -8 38
@ COL on Friday
8. N.E. Revolution 27 11-14-2 35 -3 38
vs. MET on Saturday
Chicago Fire 27 10-13-4 34 +4 37 vs.
CLB on Sunday
D.C. United 27 9-13-5 32 -9 35 vs.
DAL on Thursday
X - Clinched a playoff berth * - Conference leader
TIEBREAKER NOTES:
Tiebreak procedures are:
a. Head-to-head competition against all other teams equal in points,
based on highest points-per-game average.
b. Overall team goal differential.
c. Total goals scored.
d-f. Tiebreakers a-c are applied to each team's regular-season road
games only.
g-i. Tiebreakers a-c are applied to each team's regular-season home
games only.
j. Fewest disciplinary points
j. Coin flip.
Among Currently Tied Teams (2-way ties):
35 points:
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 3-0-0)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
Among Potentially Tied Teams (2-way ties):
48 points:
LA holds 1st tiebreaker against SJ (head-to-head: 2-1-0 - with one
head-to-head matchup remaining)
SJ leads LA in 2nd tiebreaker (goal differential: +1 - with one
head-to-head
matchup remaining)
45 points:
SJ leads COL in 2nd tiebreaker (goal differential: +16)
43 points:
DAL holds 1st tiebreaker against COL (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
41 points:
DAL holds 1st tiebreaker against CLB (head-to-head: 1-0-1)
38 points:
NE holds 1st tiebreaker against CLB (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
CLB holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head: 1-0-1)
CLB holds 2nd tiebreaker against MET (goal differential: +5)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
36 points:
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 3-0-1 - in case of
MET/NE
tie that would force 36 points)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
35 points:
CHI holds 1st tiebreaker against MET (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
CHI holds 2nd tiebreaker against KC (goal differential: +12)
CHI holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-1-0)
CHI holds 2nd tiebreaker against DC (goal differential: +13)
DC holds 1st tiebreaker against MET (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against DC (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
NE holds 1st tiebreaker against DC (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
Multiple-team tiebreakers:
3-way ties @ 38 points:
SCENARIO Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#1 CLB / KC / MET ==> CLB 3-2-1 1.83 TBD (CLB
leads MET +5 in goal diff.)
(for seeds #2, 5 and 6) MET 3-2-1 1.83 MET hold tiebreak
with KC
KC 0-2-2 0.50
#2 CLB / KC / NE ==> KC 2-1-1 1.75 Kansas City
(for seeds #2, 5 and 6) CLB 2-2-2 1.33 NE holds tiebreak
over CLB
NE 2-3-1 1.17
3-way ties @ 36 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#3 KC / MET / NE ==> MET 4-0-2 2.33 MetroStars
(for seeds #7 and 8) KC 2-1-1 1.75 KC holds tiebreak
over NE
NE 0-5-1 0.17
4-way ties @ 35 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#4 CHI / DC / KC / MET ==> CHI 5-3-2 1.70 Chicago
(for #7 seed) DC 5-4-3 1.50 go to Scenario #11
KC 3-3-2 1.38
MET 3-6-1 1.00
#5 CHI / DC / KC / NE ==> KC 5-2-1 2.00 Kansas City
(for #7 seed) CHI 4-3-3 1.50 go to Scenario #8
NE 4-5-1 1.30
DC 3-6-3 1.00
3-way ties @ 35 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#6 CHI / DC/ KC ==> KC 3-2-1 1.67 Kansas City
(for #8 seed) DC 2-3-3 1.13 CHI holds tiebreak over DC
CHI 2-2-2 1.00
#7 CHI / DC/ MET ==> CHI 4-2-2 1.75 Chicago
(for #8 seed) DC 4-2-2 1.75 DC holds tiebreak over MET
MET 2-6-0 0.75
#8 CHI / DC / NE ==> NE 4-3-1 1.63 New England
(for #8 seed) CHI 3-2-3 1.50 CHI holds tiebreak over DC
DC 2-4-2 1.00
#9 CHI / KC / MET ==> CHI 4-2-0 2.00 Chicago
(for seeds #7 and 8) MET 2-3-1 1.17 MET holds tiebreak
over KC
KC 1-2-1 1.00
#10 CHI / KC / NE ==> KC 3-1-0 2.25 Kansas City
(for seeds #7 and 8) CHI 3-2-1 1.67 CHI holds tiebreak
over NE
NE 1-4-1 0.67
#11 DC / KC / MET ==> DC 4-3-1 1.63 D.C. United
(for #8 seed) KC 2-2-2 1.33 MET holds tiebreak over KC
MET 2-3-1 1.17
#12 DC / KC / NE ==> KC 4-1-1 2.17 Kansas City
(for #8 seed) NE 3-3-0 1.50 NE holds tiebreak over DC
DC 2-5-1 0.75
FINAL WEEK SCHEDULE (all times ET):
Thursday, September 19
Dallas Burn @ DC United, 7:30 PM - ESPN2
DALLAS: WIN - with 43 points, DAL needs COL draw or loss to gain #4
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
DRAW - with 41 points, DAL secures #5 overall seed for first
round
LOSS - with 40 points, DAL secures #5 overall seed for first
round
DC UNITED: WIN - with 35 points, DC needs losses by MET AND either CHI
or KC to qualify for postseason
DRAW - with 33 points, DC is eliminated from contention
LOSS - with 32 points, DC is eliminated from contention
Friday, September 20
Kansas City Wizards @ Colorado Rapids, 9:00 PM - MetroSports
KANSAS CITY: WIN - with 38 points, KC qualifies for postseason
DRAW - with 36 points, KC qualifies for postseason
LOSS - with 35 points, KC needs 1) NE or CHI losses, or 2)
NE loss, CHI draw and a DC win to qualify for postseason
COLORADO: WIN - with 45 points, COL guaranteed #4 overall seed for
first round
DRAW - with 43 points, COL needs DAL draw or loss to keep #4
seed in first round; DAL win sends COL to #5 seed
LOSS - with 42 points, COL needs DAL draw or loss to keep #4
seed in first round; DAL win sends COL to #5 seed
Saturday, September 21
MetroStars @ New England Revolution, 7:30 PM - MSG
METROSTARS: WIN - with 38 points, MET qualify for postseason
DRAW - with 36 points, MET qualify for postseason
LOSS - with 35 points, MET need two losses among CHI, DC and
KC to qualify for postseason
NEW ENGLAND: WIN - with 38 points, NE qualify for postseason; win East
title and #2 seed with win and CLB loss
DRAW - with 36 points, NE needs CHI draw or loss to qualify
for postseason (loses tiebreak with MET)
LOSS - with 35 points, NE needs CHI loss to qualify for
postseason (holds tiebreak with DC)
Saturday, September 21
Los Angeles Galaxy @ San Jose Earthquakes, 10:00 PM - KCAL
LOS ANGELES: WIN - with 51 points, LA wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
DRAW - with 49 points, LA wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
LOSS - with 48 points, LA finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round
SAN JOSE: WIN - with 48 points, SJ wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
DRAW - with 46 points, SJ finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round
LOSS - with 45 points, SJ finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round (+16 G+/- over COL)
Sunday, September 22
Columbus Crew @ Chicago Fire, 4:00 PM - Sport TV
COLUMBUS: WIN - with 41 points, CLB wins East title and clinches #2
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
DRAW - with 39 points, CLB wins East title and clinches #2
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
LOSS - with 38 points, CLB wins East title with MET win over
NE (assuming goal differential) or MET/NE draw;
finishes #6 overall with NE win over MET
CHICAGO: WIN - with 37 points, CHI qualifies for postseason
DRAW - with 35 points, CHI needs to avoid tiebreak scenarios
5, 6 and 8 (see attached document)
LOSS - with 34 points, CHI eliminated from contention
--Apple-Mail-21-236483366
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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charset=US-ASCII
<fontfamily><param>Courier</param>Somebody at MLS spent a lot of time
putting this together...
--
MLS Cup Playoff Reset - Sunday, Sept. 15, 2002
MAX
SD TEAM GP REC PTS G+/- PTS Remaining
Game
1. X *Los Angeles Galaxy 27 15-9-3 48 +10 51
@ SJ on Saturday
2. X *Columbus Crew 27 11-11-5 38 +2 41 @
CHI on Sunday
3. X San Jose Earthquakes 27 14-10-3 45 +11 48
vs. LA on Saturday
4. X Colorado Rapids 27 13-11-3 42 -5 45 vs.
KC on Friday
5. X Dallas Burn 27 11-9-7 40 0 43 @ DC
on Thursday
6. MetroStars 27 11-14-2 35 -3 38 @ NE
on Saturday
7. Kansas City Wizards 27 9-10-8 35 -8 38
@ COL on Friday
8. N.E. Revolution 27 11-14-2 35 -3 38
vs. MET on Saturday
Chicago Fire 27 10-13-4 34 +4 37 vs.
CLB on Sunday
D.C. United 27 9-13-5 32 -9 35 vs.
DAL on Thursday
X - Clinched a playoff berth * - Conference leader
TIEBREAKER NOTES:
Tiebreak procedures are:
a. Head-to-head competition against all other teams equal in points,
based on highest points-per-game average.
b. Overall team goal differential.
c. Total goals scored.
d-f. Tiebreakers a-c are applied to each team's regular-season road
games only.
g-i. Tiebreakers a-c are applied to each team's regular-season home
games only.
j. Fewest disciplinary points
j. Coin flip.
Among Currently Tied Teams (2-way ties):
35 points:
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 3-0-0)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
Among Potentially Tied Teams (2-way ties):
48 points:
LA holds 1st tiebreaker against SJ (head-to-head: 2-1-0 - with one
head-to-head matchup remaining)
SJ leads LA in 2nd tiebreaker (goal differential: +1 - with one
head-to-head
matchup remaining)
45 points:
SJ leads COL in 2nd tiebreaker (goal differential: +16)
43 points:
DAL holds 1st tiebreaker against COL (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
41 points:
DAL holds 1st tiebreaker against CLB (head-to-head: 1-0-1)
38 points:
NE holds 1st tiebreaker against CLB (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
CLB holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head: 1-0-1)
CLB holds 2nd tiebreaker against MET (goal differential: +5)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
36 points:
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 3-0-1 - in case of
MET/NE
tie that would force 36 points)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
35 points:
CHI holds 1st tiebreaker against MET (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
CHI holds 2nd tiebreaker against KC (goal differential: +12)
CHI holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-1-0)
CHI holds 2nd tiebreaker against DC (goal differential: +13)
DC holds 1st tiebreaker against MET (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
MET holds 1st tiebreaker against KC (head-to-head competition: 1-0-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against DC (head-to-head: 2-1-1)
KC holds 1st tiebreaker against NE (head-to-head: 2-0-0)
NE holds 1st tiebreaker against DC (head-to-head: 3-1-0)
Multiple-team tiebreakers:
3-way ties @ 38 points:
SCENARIO Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#1 CLB / KC / MET ==> CLB 3-2-1 1.83 TBD (CLB
leads MET +5 in goal diff.)
(for seeds #2, 5 and 6) MET 3-2-1 1.83 MET hold tiebreak
with KC
KC 0-2-2 0.50
#2 CLB / KC / NE ==> KC 2-1-1 1.75 Kansas City
(for seeds #2, 5 and 6) CLB 2-2-2 1.33 NE holds tiebreak
over CLB
NE 2-3-1 1.17
3-way ties @ 36 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#3 KC / MET / NE ==> MET 4-0-2 2.33 MetroStars
(for seeds #7 and 8) KC 2-1-1 1.75 KC holds tiebreak
over NE
NE 0-5-1 0.17
4-way ties @ 35 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#4 CHI / DC / KC / MET ==> CHI 5-3-2 1.70 Chicago
(for #7 seed) DC 5-4-3 1.50 go to Scenario #11
KC 3-3-2 1.38
MET 3-6-1 1.00
#5 CHI / DC / KC / NE ==> KC 5-2-1 2.00 Kansas City
(for #7 seed) CHI 4-3-3 1.50 go to Scenario #8
NE 4-5-1 1.30
DC 3-6-3 1.00
3-way ties @ 35 points:
Team Record Pts Per Game Winner
#6 CHI / DC/ KC ==> KC 3-2-1 1.67 Kansas City
(for #8 seed) DC 2-3-3 1.13 CHI holds tiebreak over DC
CHI 2-2-2 1.00
#7 CHI / DC/ MET ==> CHI 4-2-2 1.75 Chicago
(for #8 seed) DC 4-2-2 1.75 DC holds tiebreak over MET
MET 2-6-0 0.75
#8 CHI / DC / NE ==> NE 4-3-1 1.63 New England
(for #8 seed) CHI 3-2-3 1.50 CHI holds tiebreak over DC
DC 2-4-2 1.00
#9 CHI / KC / MET ==> CHI 4-2-0 2.00 Chicago
(for seeds #7 and 8) MET 2-3-1 1.17 MET holds tiebreak
over KC
KC 1-2-1 1.00
#10 CHI / KC / NE ==> KC 3-1-0 2.25 Kansas City
(for seeds #7 and 8) CHI 3-2-1 1.67 CHI holds tiebreak
over NE
NE 1-4-1 0.67
#11 DC / KC / MET ==> DC 4-3-1 1.63 D.C. United
(for #8 seed) KC 2-2-2 1.33 MET holds tiebreak over KC
MET 2-3-1 1.17
#12 DC / KC / NE ==> KC 4-1-1 2.17 Kansas City
(for #8 seed) NE 3-3-0 1.50 NE holds tiebreak over DC
DC 2-5-1 0.75
FINAL WEEK SCHEDULE (all times ET):
Thursday, September 19
Dallas Burn @ DC United, 7:30 PM - ESPN2
DALLAS: WIN - with 43 points, DAL needs COL draw or loss to gain #4
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
DRAW - with 41 points, DAL secures #5 overall seed for first
round
LOSS - with 40 points, DAL secures #5 overall seed for first
round
DC UNITED: WIN - with 35 points, DC needs losses by MET AND either CHI
or KC to qualify for postseason
DRAW - with 33 points, DC is eliminated from contention
LOSS - with 32 points, DC is eliminated from contention
Friday, September 20
Kansas City Wizards @ Colorado Rapids, 9:00 PM - MetroSports
KANSAS CITY: WIN - with 38 points, KC qualifies for postseason
DRAW - with 36 points, KC qualifies for postseason
LOSS - with 35 points, KC needs 1) NE or CHI losses, or 2)
NE loss, CHI draw and a DC win to qualify for postseason
COLORADO: WIN - with 45 points, COL guaranteed #4 overall seed for
first round
DRAW - with 43 points, COL needs DAL draw or loss to keep #4
seed in first round; DAL win sends COL to #5 seed
LOSS - with 42 points, COL needs DAL draw or loss to keep #4
seed in first round; DAL win sends COL to #5 seed
Saturday, September 21
MetroStars @ New England Revolution, 7:30 PM - MSG
METROSTARS: WIN - with 38 points, MET qualify for postseason
DRAW - with 36 points, MET qualify for postseason
LOSS - with 35 points, MET need two losses among CHI, DC and
KC to qualify for postseason
NEW ENGLAND: WIN - with 38 points, NE qualify for postseason; win East
title and #2 seed with win and CLB loss
DRAW - with 36 points, NE needs CHI draw or loss to qualify
for postseason (loses tiebreak with MET)
LOSS - with 35 points, NE needs CHI loss to qualify for
postseason (holds tiebreak with DC)
Saturday, September 21
Los Angeles Galaxy @ San Jose Earthquakes, 10:00 PM - KCAL
LOS ANGELES: WIN - with 51 points, LA wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
DRAW - with 49 points, LA wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
LOSS - with 48 points, LA finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round
SAN JOSE: WIN - with 48 points, SJ wins West title and clinches #1
overall seed and home-field throughout playoffs
DRAW - with 46 points, SJ finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round
LOSS - with 45 points, SJ finishes with #3 overall seed and
home-field advantage in first round (+16 G+/- over COL)
Sunday, September 22
Columbus Crew @ Chicago Fire, 4:00 PM - Sport TV
COLUMBUS: WIN - with 41 points, CLB wins East title and clinches #2
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
DRAW - with 39 points, CLB wins East title and clinches #2
overall seed and home-field advantage in first round
LOSS - with 38 points, CLB wins East title with MET win over
NE (assuming goal differential) or MET/NE draw;
finishes #6 overall with NE win over MET
CHICAGO: WIN - with 37 points, CHI qualifies for postseason
DRAW - with 35 points, CHI needs to avoid tiebreak scenarios
5, 6 and 8 (see attached document)
LOSS - with 34 points, CHI eliminated from contention
</fontfamily>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Mon Sep 16 19:48:46 2002
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 21:48:47 -0500
To: Jay Hipps <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>,
NAS <nas@americakicks.com>
From: Bill Quigley <billq@rcnchicago.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
In-Reply-To: <A1EEACA8-C9E7-11D6-8A92-0030655870FC@wordsandgraphics.com>
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At 07:46 PM 9/16/2002 -0700, Jay Hipps wrote:
>Somebody at MLS spent a lot of time putting this together...
Reminds me of the NFL playoff scenarios that you see in the papers late in
the season.
Bill Quigley
Web Master, The Fire Alarm
www.thefirealarm.com
Chicago Correspondent - Cyber Soccer News
www.cybersoccernews.com
"When I walk down the street, I want people to say, `There goes the
greatest hitter who ever lived.' " - Ted Williams 1918-2002
--=====================_12600998==_.ALT
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<html>
At 07:46 PM 9/16/2002 -0700, Jay Hipps wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite><font face="courier">Somebody at
MLS spent a lot of time putting this together...
</font></blockquote><br><br>
Reminds me of the NFL playoff scenarios that you see in the papers late
in the season.<br><br>
<x-sigsep><p></x-sigsep>
Bill Quigley<br>
Web Master, The Fire Alarm<br>
<a href="http://www.thefirealarm.com/"; eudora="autourl">www.thefirealarm.com</a><br><br>
Chicago Correspondent - Cyber Soccer News<br>
<a href="http://www.cybersoccernews.com/"; eudora="autourl">www.cybersoccernews.com</a><br><br>
"When I walk down the street, I want people to say, `There goes the
greatest hitter who ever lived.' " - Ted Williams
1918-2002<br><br>
<br>
</html>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 03:33:01 2002
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From: "David Allan" <dallan@netcarrier.com>
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To: NAS <nas@americakicks.com>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 06:30:15 -0400
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Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
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<color><param>0100,0100,0100</param>On 16 Sep 2002, at 19:46, Jay Hipps wrote:
<color><param>7F00,0000,0000</param>> Tiebreak procedures are:
> j. Fewest disciplinary points
</color>Wasn't that one of Professor Allen's criteria? :-) I'd sure be glad to
drop out of the playoffs thanks to Kevin Stott or Noel Kenny . . .
<nofill>
David Allan
dallan@netcarrier.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 07:13:59 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] Playoff scenarios
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:34 -0400
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Who'd a thunk it...
There is a real chance that DC & NE may make the playoffs while Chicago &
the Metrostars miss out. That scenario seemed 110% unlikely even a few
weeks ago. Not only that, but LA could end up with the Supporter's Shield,
which San Jose seemed to have a stranglehold on. What a topsy-turvy season
this has been.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 07:22:49 2002
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To: kdaleb@wsu.edu, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: RE: [nas] Playoff scenarios
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Makes you think how the playoffs could turn out=2E Heck, at this point I
could see the Revs at the Cup final the way Twellman is playing=2E
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Keith Bundy kdaleb@wsu=2Eedu
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:34 -0400
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: [nas] Playoff scenarios
Who'd a thunk it=2E=2E=2E
There is a real chance that DC & NE may make the playoffs while Chicago &
the Metrostars miss out=2E That scenario seemed 110% unlikely even a few
weeks ago=2E Not only that, but LA could end up with the Supporter's Shie=
ld,
which San Jose seemed to have a stranglehold on=2E What a topsy-turvy sea=
son
this has been=2E
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 07:24:27 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:24:41 -0400
From: mbabyak@duke.edu
To: North American Soccer Mailing List <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Playoff scenarios
Message-ID: <1466130280.1032258281@[152.3.209.160]>
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Yeah, it's really been a great season in a lot of ways. Bump in
attendance, no really embarrassing officiating (at least that I've seen),
some great play on the field, and a real dogfight for the playoffs.
Watching LA-San Jose the other night really felt like watching a real pro
league. Would be wonderful to see DC and NE pull out a last minute run and
get in.
Mike Babyak
--On Tuesday, September 17, 2002 10:13 AM -0400 Keith Bundy
<kdaleb@wsu.edu> wrote:
> Who'd a thunk it...
>
> There is a real chance that DC & NE may make the playoffs while Chicago &
> the Metrostars miss out. That scenario seemed 110% unlikely even a few
> weeks ago. Not only that, but LA could end up with the Supporter's
> Shield, which San Jose seemed to have a stranglehold on. What a
> topsy-turvy season this has been.
>
>
> ---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 07:25:50 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:25:43 -0400
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>From where I was in the stands it looked like he just stomped on alegria's
head. The ref doesn't have that great slo-mo instant replay that we have
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike boettge" <popeye_mb@hotmail.com>
To: <kdaleb@wsu.edu>; <nas@americakicks.com>
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2002 8:26 PM
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/15 red card
> >From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
> (Isn't that what Zidane got - a total of
> >three games - for his raking of the Saudi player in '98?)
> >
>
> Yes. He was ejected and then had to sit out the next two games besides.
And
> he didn't really even rake the guy. He just put a little extra downward
> pressure on as leapt over the guy on the ground. Just kinda stepped on him
> when he really didn't need to. I had to see it in slo-mo to really pick it
> up. Very sharp referee.
> I didn't see the Mathis incident though. I was watching Dallas/NE.
> MikeB,StL,Mo
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 07:46:13 2002
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From: "Kevin Lindstrom" <klindstr@flash.net>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>, "Burn List" <burn-fans@topica.com>
Subject: [nas] D@MN STRAIGHT
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 09:39:44 -0500
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I usually try to keep a somewhat objective position when it comes to MLS as
a whole -- mostly in the realization that having a league is much more
important at this point than who wins -- but this piece by Viking hits the
nail on the head.
"Burn fans are tough. We take more official abuse than all the other teams
combined. We stick by our players because no one handed them to us on a
platter with no cap attached. We love our front office because they suffer
like we do. We play in the oldest stadium in the league, with the worst
amenities. We have no owner in a league that promised us one, and no sign of
that ending anytime soon. And the Burn make the playoffs ever year and make
the major market patsies look bad by comparison. I would not trade teams for
real money. You can screw us out of whatever you want, eventually you too
will hit a string of bad luck, and we'll be the ones dishing it out."
http://www.3rddegree.net/comment/fan/index.htm
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:10:02 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 08:10:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis 9/14 red card
To: nas@americakicks.com
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--- Chris Keem <chris@sportsvue.net> wrote:
> >From where I was in the stands it looked like he
> just stomped on alegria's
> head. The ref doesn't have that great slo-mo
> instant replay that we have
>
It wasn't a head shot. And the look/expression on
Mathis' face looked like he was stomping on Algeria's
stomach/chest was deliberate. Right in front of the
ref!
Anyone have photos of the cleat marks it might have
left?
Kirsten
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! News - Today's headlines
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:19:11 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
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By Ives Galarcep
North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head
in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in response
to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping
on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly. Zambrano
knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard that
Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident, the
coach finally spoke out.
"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result of
his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't behave
the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to let him get
away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the off-season
with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's fine.
We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, always
willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some
would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS
match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U.S.
national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game at
the World Cup.
"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The issues
about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it and
does something about it."
There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's red
card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulated
six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much better
with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 2001
to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last year,
but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano
addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, which
made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
What can the Metros do?
Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that he
is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn't
speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a
stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sort
of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior
could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the case,
Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more time
arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.
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Subject: [nas] St. Johns to open up in new soccer only stadia
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:30:44 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] Possible new DCU training center
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:30:17 -0400
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26627-2002Sep16.html
Where have they been training since they lost their old facility? (the one
that the church group bought)
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:32:51 2002
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To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had=2E Back in M=
ay
he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
the sport=2E Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into effe=
ct=2E
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry=2Ecom
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
By Ives Galarcep
North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept=2E 17, 2002
Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head=
in disbelief=2E The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in respon=
se
to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D=2EC=2E United, or a result of see=
ing
his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further=2E Zambrano was left
speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control=2E
At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping=
on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly=2E Zambra=
no
knew better=2E He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to=
believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard tha=
t
Mathis called his stepping on D=2EC=2E midfielder Jose Alegria an accident=
, the
coach finally spoke out=2E
"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put in=
to
words what is wrong with Mathis=2E "I am not professionally qualified to
identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to=
deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over=2E"
Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
best described as maniacal at times=2E An easy-going and affable person of=
f
the field, Mathis switches from Dr=2E Jeckyl to Mr=2E Hyde on the field, w=
ith
the soccer ball serving as his full moon=2E He rails on officials, berates=
teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
smack in the face=2E Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
it=2E When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result =
of
his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion=2E
"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't behav=
e
the way he does," said Zambrano=2E "We care about him too much to let him =
get
away with acting this way=2E We have to address this issue in the off-seas=
on
with a severity and a compassion that it deserves=2E"
Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him=2E
"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis=2E "That's fi=
ne=2E
We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it=2E"
Temperamental soccer players are nothing new=2E The stories of Roy Keane's=
persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled=2E But unlik=
e
Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
not=2E Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, alw=
ays
willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
toughest of losses=2E On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some=
would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS=
match=2E Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U=
=2ES=2E
national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game =
at
the World Cup=2E
"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said=2E "The iss=
ues
about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it a=
nd
does something about it=2E"
There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions=2E While Saturday's =
red
card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulate=
d
six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001=2E He did not do much be=
tter
with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 200=
1
to 2002 (six yellows and one red)=2E
Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates=2E Brazilia=
n
forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last yea=
r,
but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees=2E Zambrano
addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, whi=
ch
made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow=2E
What can the Metros do?
Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem=2E The team will
already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
expires after the 2003 season=2E The Georgia native has already stated tha=
t he
is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn'=
t
speed up it's contract talks=2E The anger management issues could become a=
stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sor=
t
of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives=2E The talk of bad behavior
could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors=2E Whatever the c=
ase,
Zambrano was at least right in one statement=2E Mathis cannot spend more t=
ime
arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
receiving cards=2E Even he would not argue with that=2E
---
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Subject: [nas] OT: Champions League preview
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Subject: [nas] Dipsy Selowane Signs With Fire
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
sometimes. I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee surgery
as well. And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the hardest
goal for the US in Korea vs Korea. Think that was easy? I was there , it was
not. Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza sense of behavior,
but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the buck to save his job
and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond saving.
BD
From: "billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchicago.com>
Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago.com
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had. Back in May
he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into effect.
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
By Ives Galarcep
North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head
in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in response
to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping
on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly. Zambrano
knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard that
Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident, the
coach finally spoke out.
"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result of
his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't behave
the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to let him get
away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the off-season
with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's fine.
We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, always
willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some
would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS
match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U.S.
national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game at
the World Cup.
"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The issues
about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it and
does something about it."
There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's red
card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulated
six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much better
with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 2001
to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last year,
but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano
addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, which
made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
What can the Metros do?
Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that he
is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn't
speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a
stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sort
of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior
could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the case,
Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more time
arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.
---
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To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com
To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end someti=
mes. I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee surgery as we=
ll. And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the hardest goal for=
the US in Korea vs Korea. Think that was easy? I was there , it was not. &n=
bsp;Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza sense of behavior, but =
get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the buck to save his job and as=
anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond saving.<BR>
BD<BR>
<HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"95%"><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><B>From: </B>"billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchic=
ago.com><BR>
<B>Reply-To: </B>billq@rcnchicago.com<BR>
<B>Date: </B>Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400<BR>
<B>To: </B>peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com<BR>
<B>Subject: </B>RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><TT>Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he ha=
d. Back in May<BR>
he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he<BR=
>
has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of<BR=
>
the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into ef=
fect.<BR>
<BR>
Original Message:<BR>
-----------------<BR>
From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com<BR>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500<BR>
To: nas@americakicks.com<BR>
Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
By Ives Galarcep<BR>
North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002<BR>
<BR>
Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head<=
BR>
in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in response<=
BR>
to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing<B=
R>
his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left<BR>
speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.<BR>
<BR>
At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match<BR>
seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping<=
BR>
on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly. Zambrano<=
BR>
knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to<BR=
>
believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard that=
<BR>
Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident, the=
<BR>
coach finally spoke out.<BR>
<BR>
"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could n=
ot put into<BR>
words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to=
<BR>
identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to<=
BR>
deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."=
<BR>
<BR>
Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be<B=
R>
best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off<B=
R>
the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with<B=
R>
the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates<BR=
>
teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or<B=
R>
smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since<BR>
drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of<B=
R>
it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result of<=
BR>
his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.<BR>
<BR>
"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't b=
ehave<BR>
the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to l=
et him get<BR>
away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the off-season<=
BR>
with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."<BR>
<BR>
Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.<BR>
<BR>
"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is<B=
R>
bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "Th=
at's fine.<BR>
We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."<BR>
<BR>
Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's<BR=
>
persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike<B=
R>
Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is<BR=
>
not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, always=
<BR>
willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the<B=
R>
toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some<BR=
>
would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS<=
BR>
match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U.S.=
<BR>
national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and<BR>
suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game a=
t<BR>
the World Cup.<BR>
<BR>
"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back t=
hen<BR>
and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "=
The issues<BR>
about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an<BR=
>
issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it an=
d<BR>
does something about it."<BR>
<BR>
There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's red=
<BR>
card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulated=
<BR>
six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much bette=
r<BR>
with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 2001=
<BR>
to 2002 (six yellows and one red).<BR>
<BR>
Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian<B=
R>
forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last year=
,<BR>
but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano<BR>
addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, whic=
h<BR>
made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.<BR>
<BR>
What can the Metros do?<BR>
<BR>
Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will<BR>
already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract<BR>
expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that h=
e<BR>
is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn't=
<BR>
speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a<BR=
>
stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sort=
<BR>
of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior<BR>
could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the case=
,<BR>
Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more time=
<BR>
arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue<BR>
receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
---<BR>
NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www.americakicks.com)<BR>
To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com<BR>
To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com<BR>
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<BR>
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<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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<BR>
</TT></BLOCKQUOTE><TT><BR>
</TT>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:47:51 2002
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Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:47:58 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:48:04 -0400
From: mbabyak@duke.edu
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Message-ID: <1471133270.1032263284@[152.3.209.160]>
In-Reply-To: <410-22002921715330264@M2W067.mail2web.com>
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But this problem preceded the SI cover by a long time. If you recall, he
was already a recognized loose cannon for the Nats.
--On Tuesday, September 17, 2002 11:33 AM -0400 "billq@rcnchicago.com"
<billq@rcnchicago.com> wrote:
> Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had. Back in May
> he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
> has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
> the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into
> effect.
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com
> Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
> To: nas@americakicks.com
> Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
>
>
> By Ives Galarcep
> North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
>
> Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head
> in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in response
> to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
> his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
> speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
>
> At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
> seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping
> on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly. Zambrano
> knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
> believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard
> that Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an
> accident, the coach finally spoke out.
>
> "Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put
> into words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified
> to identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he
> needs to deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is
> over."
>
> Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
> best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
> the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
> the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
> teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
> smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
> drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
> it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result of
> his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
>
> "I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't
> behave the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to
> let him get away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in
> the off-season with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
>
> Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
>
> "Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
> bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's
> fine. We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
>
> Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
> persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
> Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
> not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team,
> always willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media
> after the toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer,
> and some would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very
> first MLS match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis'
> behavior with U.S. national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three
> years ago, and suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis
> starting only one game at the World Cup.
>
> "I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
> and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The
> issues about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that
> became an issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns
> up to it and does something about it."
>
> There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's
> red card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star
> accumulated six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not
> do much better with the national team, leading all players on total cards
> earned from 2001 to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
>
> Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
> forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last
> year, but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees.
> Zambrano addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's
> match, which made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
>
> What can the Metros do?
>
> Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
> already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
> expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that
> he is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS
> doesn't speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could
> become a stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros
> suggest some sort of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk
> of bad behavior could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors.
> Whatever the case, Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis
> cannot spend more time arguing than playing, and more importantly he
> cannot afford to continue receiving cards. Even he would not argue with
> that.
>
>
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www.americakicks.com)
> To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com
> To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
>
>
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> http://mail2web.com/ .
>
>
>
> ---
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> To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.com
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:49:46 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 08:51:04 -0700
Subject: [nas] MLS Playoff breakdown (PDF file version)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Nice PDF download from MLS HQ
http://www.mlsnet.com/special/mlscup/02/media/playoff_scenarios.pdf
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:51:47 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:48:40 -0400
To: nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: [nas] CL Prediction
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Any predictions on Roma Vs Real today?
I'll go for Real 2-0 Roma...
Liverpool vs Valencia - 3-2 to a leaky Liverpool
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:54:46 2002
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Subject: RE: [nas] CL Prediction
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:54:56 -0400
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I predict that Owen finally gets off his butt and scores today=2E
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Niall Swan nialls@rcn=2Ecom
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:48:40 -0400
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: [nas] CL Prediction
Any predictions on Roma Vs Real today?
I'll go for Real 2-0 Roma=2E=2E=2E
Liverpool vs Valencia - 3-2 to a leaky Liverpool
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www=2Esoccerresort=2Ecom=20
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:56:31 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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USSF report:
http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=22086&itype=
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:55:43 -0700
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)
Uruguay 2 US U17's 0
-----
http://www.futbol.com.uy/mvdnews/hnnoticiaj1.cgi?936,0,0,20020916
Uruguay the Convincing Champion!
Header
The Uruguay U-17 Team left with the International Friendly Tournament Title
that recently took place in Italy, after overcoming the other finalist
United States by a score of 2-0. The winning goals were converted in the
first half by Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra.
This is a notable accomplishment for the Uruguay U-17 squed that is
currently preparing for the South American championship to take place next
year in Venezuela
Directed by "Polilla" Da Silva, they won 2-0 in the tournament final against
the United States through the goals of Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra in
the first half, a game played in the city of Gaeta's stadium.
Uruguay finished a great tournament once they consecrated it as champions in
convincing form. It is noteworthy to remember that in the tournament's first
phase Uruguay beat the local Italian squad through penalties after
equalizing the game 1-1 in regular time, then the Czech Republic (3-1),
Ireland (3-0), and then won the final against the United States (2-0).
The Baby Blue Delegation will be arriving in our country the 18th,
Wednesday, at 10:30 in the morning at the Internacional de Carrasco Airport.
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<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: [nas] US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)</TITLE>
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USSF report:<BR>
http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=3D22086&itype=3D<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"95%"><BR>
<B>From: </B><big_dog@fastmail.fm><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Mon, 16 Sep 2002 17:55:43 -0700<BR>
<B>To: </B>NAS <NAS@americakicks.com><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>[nas] US U17's v Uruguay FISF Final (R)<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><BLOCKQUOTE><BLOCKQUOTE>Uruguay 2 US U17's 0<BR>
-----<BR>
http://www.futbol.com.uy/mvdnews/hnnoticiaj1.cgi?936,0,0,20020916<BR>
<BR>
<FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><FONT SIZE=3D"5"><FONT FACE=3D"Arial">Uruguay the Convinc=
ing Champion!</FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT FACE=3D"Arial"><FONT SIZE=3D"4"> <BR>
<BR>
<I>Header</I> <BR>
<B>The Uruguay U-17 Team left with the International Friendly Tournament Ti=
tle that recently took place in Italy, after overcoming the other finalist U=
nited States by a score of 2-0. The winning goals were converted in the firs=
t half by Juan Albin and Ivan de la Sierra.</B> <BR>
<BR>
This is a notable accomplishment for the Uruguay U-17 squed that is current=
ly preparing for the South American championship to take place next year in =
Venezuela <BR>
<BR>
Directed by "Polilla" Da Silva, they won 2-0 in the tournament fi=
nal against the United States through the goals of Juan Albin and Ivan de la=
Sierra in the first half, a game played in the city of Gaeta's stadium. <BR=
>
<BR>
Uruguay finished a great tournament once they consecrated it as champions i=
n convincing form. It is noteworthy to remember that in the tournament's fir=
st phase Uruguay beat the local Italian squad through penalties after equali=
zing the game 1-1 in regular time, then the Czech Republic (3-1), Ireland (3=
-0), and then won the final against the United States (2-0). <BR>
<BR>
The Baby Blue Delegation will be arriving in our country the 18th, Wednesda=
y, at 10:30 in the morning at the Internacional de Carrasco Airport.<BR>
</FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"2"><BR>
</FONT><BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
</BODY>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:57:38 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:54:31 -0400
To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>,<nas@americakicks.com>
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
In-Reply-To: <B9AC9CE0.A25%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Yes, I am not sure Mathis has something most other players don't. Many
players get more aggressive on the field, and while Mathis has gone too far
this weekend, my view is that this is not enough to suggest psychotherapy
(maybe he needs it, no more than the rest of us). It seems like his Coach
is over-reacting. What about good old fashioned public loyalty, and an arm
around the shoulder behind the scenes.
Now Keane - there is a case for some "professional" help. But Mathis - not yet!
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
At 08:48 AM 9/17/02 -0700, big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
>Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
>sometimes. I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee
>surgery as well. And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the
>hardest goal for the US in Korea vs Korea. Think that was easy? I was
>there , it was not. Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza
>sense of behavior, but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the
>buck to save his job and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond saving.
>BD
>
>>From: "billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchicago.com>
>>Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago.com
>>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
>>To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
>>Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
>>
>Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had. Back in May
>he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
>has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
>the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into effect.
>
>Original Message:
>-----------------
>From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com
>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
>To: nas@americakicks.com
>Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
>
>
>
>By Ives Galarcep
>North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
>
>Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head
>in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in response
>to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
>his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
>speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
>
>At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
>seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping
>on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly. Zambrano
>knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
>believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard that
>Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident, the
>coach finally spoke out.
>
>"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
>words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
>identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
>deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
>
>Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
>best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
>the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
>the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
>teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
>smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
>drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
>it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result of
>his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
>
>"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't behave
>the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to let him get
>away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the off-season
>with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
>
>Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
>
>"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
>bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's fine.
>We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
>
>Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
>persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
>Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
>not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, always
>willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
>toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some
>would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS
>match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U.S.
>national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
>suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game at
>the World Cup.
>
>"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
>and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The issues
>about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
>issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it and
>does something about it."
>
>There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's red
>card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulated
>six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much better
>with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 2001
>to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
>
>Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
>forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last year,
>but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano
>addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, which
>made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
>
>What can the Metros do?
>
>Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
>already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
>expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that he
>is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn't
>speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a
>stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sort
>of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior
>could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the case,
>Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more time
>arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
>receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.
>
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:57:56 2002
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From: "billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchicago.com>
To: big_dog@fastmail.fm, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:58:06 -0400
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There are those who would disagree with the professional tag=2E :) That
being said, I know of Clint's past and he did score a cracker of a goal in=
the WC, but since he has returned he really has seen his year go downhill,=
with the knee injury, the frustration of not being sold overseas and now
this red card=2E True, OZ may be trying to justify maybe trading him afte=
r
the season (not to Chicago dear god), but still after seeing the evidence =
I
think that you have to be a little off your rocker to do what he did
Saturday=2E =20
Original Message:
-----------------
From: big_dog@fastmail=2Efm
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 08:48:33 -0700
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
sometimes=2E I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee sur=
gery
as well=2E And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the hardest=
goal for the US in Korea vs Korea=2E Think that was easy? I was there , it=
was
not=2E Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza sense of behavior=
,
but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the buck to save his job
and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond saving=2E
BD
From: "billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom" <billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom>
Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
To: peter@lexandterry=2Ecom, nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had=2E Back in M=
ay
he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
the sport=2E Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into effe=
ct=2E
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry=2Ecom
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
By Ives Galarcep
North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept=2E 17, 2002
Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his head=
in disbelief=2E The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in respon=
se
to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D=2EC=2E United, or a result of see=
ing
his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further=2E Zambrano was left
speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control=2E
At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally stepping=
on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly=2E Zambra=
no
knew better=2E He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to=
believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard tha=
t
Mathis called his stepping on D=2EC=2E midfielder Jose Alegria an accident=
, the
coach finally spoke out=2E
"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put in=
to
words what is wrong with Mathis=2E "I am not professionally qualified to
identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to=
deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over=2E"
Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
best described as maniacal at times=2E An easy-going and affable person of=
f
the field, Mathis switches from Dr=2E Jeckyl to Mr=2E Hyde on the field, w=
ith
the soccer ball serving as his full moon=2E He rails on officials, berates=
teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
smack in the face=2E Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
it=2E When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result =
of
his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion=2E
"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't behav=
e
the way he does," said Zambrano=2E "We care about him too much to let him =
get
away with acting this way=2E We have to address this issue in the off-seas=
on
with a severity and a compassion that it deserves=2E"
Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him=2E
"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis=2E "That's fi=
ne=2E
We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it=2E"
Temperamental soccer players are nothing new=2E The stories of Roy Keane's=
persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled=2E But unlik=
e
Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
not=2E Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team, alw=
ays
willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
toughest of losses=2E On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some=
would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first MLS=
match=2E Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with U=
=2ES=2E
national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game =
at
the World Cup=2E
"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said=2E "The iss=
ues
about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it a=
nd
does something about it=2E"
There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions=2E While Saturday's =
red
card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star accumulate=
d
six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001=2E He did not do much be=
tter
with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from 200=
1
to 2002 (six yellows and one red)=2E
Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates=2E Brazilia=
n
forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last yea=
r,
but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees=2E Zambrano
addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match, whi=
ch
made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow=2E
What can the Metros do?
Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem=2E The team will
already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
expires after the 2003 season=2E The Georgia native has already stated tha=
t he
is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS doesn'=
t
speed up it's contract talks=2E The anger management issues could become a=
stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some sor=
t
of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives=2E The talk of bad behavior
could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors=2E Whatever the c=
ase,
Zambrano was at least right in one statement=2E Mathis cannot spend more t=
ime
arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
receiving cards=2E Even he would not argue with that=2E
---
NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www=2Eamericakicks=2Ecom)
To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas=2Eamericakicks=2Ecom
To post, send an email to nas@americakicks=2Ecom
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks=2Ecom
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 08:59:08 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:56:00 -0400
To: billq@rcnchicago.com,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: RE: [nas] CL Prediction
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Ah Bill- we all have peaks and valleys!! ;-)
At 11:54 AM 9/17/02 -0400, billq@rcnchicago.com wrote:
>I predict that Owen finally gets off his butt and scores today.
>
>Original Message:
>-----------------
>From: Niall Swan nialls@rcn.com
>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:48:40 -0400
>To: nas@americakicks.com
>Subject: [nas] CL Prediction
>
>
>Any predictions on Roma Vs Real today?
>
>I'll go for Real 2-0 Roma...
>
>Liverpool vs Valencia - 3-2 to a leaky Liverpool
>
>Niall
>
>The Soccer Resort
>www.soccerresort.com
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 09:02:15 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:59:08 -0400
To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] St. Johns to open up in new soccer only stadia
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Saw it last week - was training on adjacent field. Very nice indeed.
Mmmmmmm. Everyone was raving about it.
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
At 08:26 AM 9/17/02 -0700, you wrote:
>http://www.nytimes.com/2002/09/17/sports/soccer/17SOCCER.html?tntemail1
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 09:12:22 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 09:13:35 -0700
Subject: Re: [nas] Possible new DCU training center
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: Keith Bundy <kdaleb@wsu.edu>,
North American Soccer Mailing List <nas@americakicks.com>
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At the stadium practice fields.
From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:30:17 -0400
To: "North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] Possible new DCU training center
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26627-2002Sep16.html
Where have they been training since they lost their old facility? (the one
that the church group bought)
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At the stadium practice fields.<BR>
<HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"95%"><BLOCKQUOTE><B>From: </B>"Keith =
Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:30:17 -0400<BR>
<B>To: </B>"North American Soccer Mailing List" <nas@americaki=
cks.com><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>[nas] Possible new DCU training center<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE><TT>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26627-2002Se=
p16.html<BR>
<BR>
Where have they been training since they lost their old facility? (the one<=
BR>
that the church group bought)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 09:15:07 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 12:15:32 -0400
To: nas@americakicks.com
From: Evan Whitney <Evan_Whitney@harvard.edu>
Subject: Re: [nas] St. Johns to open up in new soccer only stadia
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>Saw it last week - was training on adjacent field. Very nice indeed.
>Mmmmmmm. Everyone was raving about it.
Some pictures here:
http://www.redstormsports.com/pls/portal30/retreive_img_data?img_id=2537
http://www.redstormsports.com/pls/portal30/retreive_img_data?img_id=2538
http://www.redstormsports.com/pls/portal30/retreive_img_data?img_id=2539
http://www.redstormsports.com/pls/portal30/retreive_img_data?img_id=2540
http://www.redstormsports.com/pls/portal30/retreive_img_data?img_id=2541
-Evan
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 09:19:04 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 09:20:35 -0700
Subject: [nas] MLS Newslinks 09-17 (11)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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Rimando named player of the week
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/pow0916rimando.html
MLS Newsstand 09-17 (10)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0917newsstand.html
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 10:05:31 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 12:00:27 -0500
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Amen. Geez, I cannot believe this thread.
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Niall Swan" <nialls@rcn.com>
To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>; <nas@americakicks.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> Yes, I am not sure Mathis has something most other players don't. Many
> players get more aggressive on the field, and while Mathis has gone too
far
> this weekend, my view is that this is not enough to suggest psychotherapy
> (maybe he needs it, no more than the rest of us). It seems like his Coach
> is over-reacting. What about good old fashioned public loyalty, and an arm
> around the shoulder behind the scenes.
>
> Now Keane - there is a case for some "professional" help. But Mathis - not
yet!
>
> Niall
>
> The Soccer Resort
> www.soccerresort.com
>
>
>
>
> At 08:48 AM 9/17/02 -0700, big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
> >Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
> >sometimes. I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee
> >surgery as well. And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the
> >hardest goal for the US in Korea vs Korea. Think that was easy? I was
> >there , it was not. Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza
> >sense of behavior, but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the
> >buck to save his job and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond
saving.
> >BD
> >
> >>From: "billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchicago.com>
> >>Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago.com
> >>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
> >>To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
> >>Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> >>
> >Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had. Back in
May
> >he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
> >has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
> >the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into
effect.
> >
> >Original Message:
> >-----------------
> >From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com
> >Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
> >To: nas@americakicks.com
> >Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> >
> >
> >
> >By Ives Galarcep
> >North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
> >
> >Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his
head
> >in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in
response
> >to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
> >his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
> >speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
> >
> >At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
> >seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally
stepping
> >on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly.
Zambrano
> >knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
> >believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard
that
> >Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident,
the
> >coach finally spoke out.
> >
> >"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put
into
> >words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
> >identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs
to
> >deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
> >
> >Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
> >best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
> >the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
> >the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
> >teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
> >smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
> >drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
> >it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result
of
> >his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
> >
> >"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't
behave
> >the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to let him
get
> >away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the
off-season
> >with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
> >
> >Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
> >
> >"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
> >bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's
fine.
> >We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
> >
> >Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
> >persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
> >Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
> >not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team,
always
> >willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
> >toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some
> >would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first
MLS
> >match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with
U.S.
> >national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
> >suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game
at
> >the World Cup.
> >
> >"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
> >and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The
issues
> >about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
> >issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it
and
> >does something about it."
> >
> >There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's
red
> >card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star
accumulated
> >six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much
better
> >with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from
2001
> >to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
> >
> >Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
> >forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last
year,
> >but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano
> >addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match,
which
> >made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
> >
> >What can the Metros do?
> >
> >Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
> >already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
> >expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that
he
> >is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS
doesn't
> >speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a
> >stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some
sort
> >of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior
> >could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the
case,
> >Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more
time
> >arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
> >receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 10:11:53 2002
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From: RichieAnimal@cs.com
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 13:11:50 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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In a message dated 9/17/2002 11:20:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
peter@lexandterry.com writes:
> "Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
> words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
> identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
> deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
>
This is one of the many reasons why Zambrano will not be coaching the
Metrostars next season. He did the same thing with Diallo earlier this
season. The pressure of winning seems to be too much for OZ he needs a rest.
Have a problem with a player take him a side privately, and talk to him about
it. You don't say anything about one of your players to the press that could
hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
That foul was stupid, but it certainly wasn't vicious. Another official could
have given him a yellow, and not a red. He should be given a one game
suspension, and not more then that. That DC player was not injured. Mathis
wound up standing between the players legs after the players slide tackle if
I am remembering right. I wonder if the Metrostars will bring that up at the
arbitration hearing.
That problem I have with Mathis is that he talks to much on the field. He
gets cards for that, just as Ramos got cards for doing that most of career
except with the national team. Ramos has been very quiet this year.
On that game, it was an important game. Then why would Oz not start Andy
Williams in that game? He can pass, he is quick and he can beat people off
the dribble. Play Williams, Ramos, and Mathis on the same field at the same
time. Was Williams injured? That would be the only reason not to play
Williams. Plus Williams works well with Diallo.
Richie
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/17/2002 11:20:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, peter@lexandterry.com writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
<BR>words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
<BR>identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
<BR>deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>This is one of the many reasons why Zambrano will not be coaching the Metrostars next season. He did the same thing with Diallo earlier this season. The pressure of winning seems to be too much for OZ he needs a rest.
<BR>
<BR>Have a problem with a player take him a side privately, and talk to him about it. You don't say anything about one of your players to the press that could hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
<BR>
<BR>That foul was stupid, but it certainly wasn't vicious. Another official could have given him a yellow, and not a red. He should be given a one game suspension, and not more then that. That DC player was not injured. Mathis wound up standing between the players legs after the players slide tackle if I am remembering right. I wonder if the Metrostars will bring that up at the arbitration hearing.
<BR>
<BR>That problem I have with Mathis is that he talks to much on the field. He gets cards for that, just as Ramos got cards for doing that most of career except with the national team. Ramos has been very quiet this year.
<BR>
<BR>On that game, it was an important game. Then why would Oz not start Andy Williams in that game? He can pass, he is quick and he can beat people off the dribble. Play Williams, Ramos, and Mathis on the same field at the same time. Was Williams injured? That would be the only reason not to play Williams. Plus Williams works well with Diallo.
<BR>
<BR>Richie
<BR>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 10:21:50 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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Guys, I didn't mean to imply that Clint had mental health problems=2E Tho=
se
who know me well know that I am supersensitive to that=2E Once I had a
chance to review what I wrote (done in a hurried break this morning), I
think that the spirit of my remarks got me in trouble=2E Again, I think t=
hat
Clint has been racked with bad luck since the WC, but he is by far not
needing to see a shrink for his problems=2E An attitude adjustment on the=
field perhaps, but not mental helath treatments=2E Sorry if I stepped on =
any
toes out here=2E
Bill Q=2E
Original Message:
-----------------
From: MrMoore mrmoore01@prodigy=2Enet
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 12:00:27 -0500
To: big_dog@fastmail=2Efm, nas@americakicks=2Ecom, nialls@rcn=2Ecom
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Amen=2E Geez, I cannot believe this thread=2E
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: "Niall Swan" <nialls@rcn=2Ecom>
To: <big_dog@fastmail=2Efm>; <nas@americakicks=2Ecom>
Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> Yes, I am not sure Mathis has something most other players don't=2E Many=
> players get more aggressive on the field, and while Mathis has gone too
far
> this weekend, my view is that this is not enough to suggest psychotherap=
y
> (maybe he needs it, no more than the rest of us)=2E It seems like his Co=
ach
> is over-reacting=2E What about good old fashioned public loyalty, and an=
arm
> around the shoulder behind the scenes=2E
>
> Now Keane - there is a case for some "professional" help=2E But Mathis -=
not
yet!
>
> Niall
>
> The Soccer Resort
> www=2Esoccerresort=2Ecom
>
>
>
>
> At 08:48 AM 9/17/02 -0700, big_dog@fastmail=2Efm wrote:
> >Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
> >sometimes=2E I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee
> >surgery as well=2E And despite the major one, some may argue he scored =
the
> >hardest goal for the US in Korea vs Korea=2E Think that was easy? I was=
> >there , it was not=2E Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza=
> >sense of behavior, but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the=
> >buck to save his job and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond
saving=2E
> >BD
> >
> >>From: "billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom" <billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom>
> >>Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago=2Ecom
> >>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
> >>To: peter@lexandterry=2Ecom, nas@americakicks=2Ecom
> >>Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> >>
> >Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had=2E Back i=
n
May
> >he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then h=
e
> >has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling o=
f
> >the sport=2E Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into
effect=2E
> >
> >Original Message:
> >-----------------
> >From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry=2Ecom
> >Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
> >To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
> >Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> >
> >
> >
> >By Ives Galarcep
> >North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept=2E 17, 2002
> >
> >Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his
head
> >in disbelief=2E The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in
response
> >to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D=2EC=2E United, or a result of =
seeing
> >his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further=2E Zambrano was lef=
t
> >speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control=2E
> >
> >At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match=
> >seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally
stepping
> >on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly=2E
Zambrano
> >knew better=2E He has seen his star player lose his head too many times=
to
> >believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard
that
> >Mathis called his stepping on D=2EC=2E midfielder Jose Alegria an accid=
ent,
the
> >coach finally spoke out=2E
> >
> >"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put=
into
> >words what is wrong with Mathis=2E "I am not professionally qualified t=
o
> >identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs=
to
> >deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over=2E=
"
> >
> >Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can =
be
> >best described as maniacal at times=2E An easy-going and affable person=
off
> >the field, Mathis switches from Dr=2E Jeckyl to Mr=2E Hyde on the field=
, with
> >the soccer ball serving as his full moon=2E He rails on officials, bera=
tes
> >teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push =
or
> >smack in the face=2E Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
> >drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired =
of
> >it=2E When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a resu=
lt
of
> >his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion=2E
> >
> >"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't
behave
> >the way he does," said Zambrano=2E "We care about him too much to let h=
im
get
> >away with acting this way=2E We have to address this issue in the
off-season
> >with a severity and a compassion that it deserves=2E"
> >
> >Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him=2E
> >
> >"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
> >bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis=2E "That's=
fine=2E
> >We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it=2E"
> >
> >Temperamental soccer players are nothing new=2E The stories of Roy Kean=
e's
> >persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled=2E But un=
like
> >Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis i=
s
> >not=2E Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team,
always
> >willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after t=
he
> >toughest of losses=2E On the field he transforms into a screamer, and s=
ome
> >would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first
MLS
> >match=2E Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior wit=
h
U=2ES=2E
> >national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
> >suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one ga=
me
at
> >the World Cup=2E
> >
> >"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back th=
en
> >and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said=2E "The
issues
> >about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became a=
n
> >issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to i=
t
and
> >does something about it=2E"
> >
> >There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions=2E While Saturday=
's
red
> >card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star
accumulated
> >six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001=2E He did not do much=
better
> >with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from
2001
> >to 2002 (six yellows and one red)=2E
> >
> >Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates=2E Brazi=
lian
> >forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last
year,
> >but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees=2E Zambra=
no
> >addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match,
which
> >made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow=2E
> >
> >What can the Metros do?
> >
> >Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem=2E The team will=
> >already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract=
> >expires after the 2003 season=2E The Georgia native has already stated =
that
he
> >is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS
doesn't
> >speed up it's contract talks=2E The anger management issues could becom=
e a
> >stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some
sort
> >of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives=2E The talk of bad behavi=
or
> >could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors=2E Whatever th=
e
case,
> >Zambrano was at least right in one statement=2E Mathis cannot spend mor=
e
time
> >arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue=
> >receiving cards=2E Even he would not argue with that=2E
> >
> >
> >
> >---
> >NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www=2Eamericakicks=2Ecom)
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> >
> >
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 10:39:01 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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On Tuesday, September 17, 2002 at 01:11:50 PM, RichieAnimal@cs.com wrote:
> On that game, it was an important game. Then why would Oz not start Andy
> Williams in that game?
I had a chance to speak with Andy Williams before the game. He was very disappointed that he wasn't starting. He did get in and play.
Now as to putting Ted Chronopolous up top, what the heck was Oz thinking???
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 11:03:40 2002
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Reply-To: <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
From: "Timothy D. Ristorcelli" <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US Soccer News Links 09-17-02
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:04:25 -0400
Message-ID: <NFBBIPKNNAKPKDLEMCLEAEBLCDAA.crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
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US Soccer News Links 09-17-02
http://www.sams-army.com/index.php/Mlist=news/Nyear=2002/Nmonth=09/Nday=17
____________________________________
Timothy D. Ristorcelli, MBA
crazo@tampabay.rr.com
Check out: http://www.sams-army.com
ICQ: 1361610
____________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 11:30:18 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:27:09 -0400
To: billq@rcnchicago.com,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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No worries Bill - but you do make a valid point. He has not yet become the
public face and poster boy that many expected (and some might say US Soccer
needs).
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 01:21 PM 9/17/02 -0400, billq@rcnchicago.com wrote:
>Guys, I didn't mean to imply that Clint had mental health problems. Those
>who know me well know that I am supersensitive to that. Once I had a
>chance to review what I wrote (done in a hurried break this morning), I
>think that the spirit of my remarks got me in trouble. Again, I think that
>Clint has been racked with bad luck since the WC, but he is by far not
>needing to see a shrink for his problems. An attitude adjustment on the
>field perhaps, but not mental helath treatments. Sorry if I stepped on any
>toes out here.
>
>Bill Q.
>
>Original Message:
>-----------------
>From: MrMoore mrmoore01@prodigy.net
>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 12:00:27 -0500
>To: big_dog@fastmail.fm, nas@americakicks.com, nialls@rcn.com
>Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
>
>
>Amen. Geez, I cannot believe this thread.
>Jeff
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Niall Swan" <nialls@rcn.com>
>To: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>; <nas@americakicks.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 10:54 AM
>Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
>
>
> > Yes, I am not sure Mathis has something most other players don't. Many
> > players get more aggressive on the field, and while Mathis has gone too
>far
> > this weekend, my view is that this is not enough to suggest psychotherapy
> > (maybe he needs it, no more than the rest of us). It seems like his Coach
> > is over-reacting. What about good old fashioned public loyalty, and an arm
> > around the shoulder behind the scenes.
> >
> > Now Keane - there is a case for some "professional" help. But Mathis - not
>yet!
> >
> > Niall
> >
> > The Soccer Resort
> > www.soccerresort.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > At 08:48 AM 9/17/02 -0700, big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
> > >Jeese Bill, for a professional writer you sure dive off the deep end
> > >sometimes. I tend to remember the major knee surgery, the minor knee
> > >surgery as well. And despite the major one, some may argue he scored the
> > >hardest goal for the US in Korea vs Korea. Think that was easy? I was
> > >there , it was not. Im not debating Clint is off the wall in a Gazza
> > >sense of behavior, but get the impression Octavio is trying to pass the
> > >buck to save his job and as anyone in NY will tell you, thats beyond
>saving.
> > >BD
> > >
> > >>From: "billq@rcnchicago.com" <billq@rcnchicago.com>
> > >>Reply-To: billq@rcnchicago.com
> > >>Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 11:33:00 -0400
> > >>To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
> > >>Subject: RE: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> > >>
> > >Talk about someone who has lost all the momentum that he had. Back in
>May
> > >he looked to become the face of soccer in this country and since then he
> > >has just sunk down to the bottom while Donovan has become the darling of
> > >the sport. Then again, it could be the SI Jinx finally coming into
>effect.
> > >
> > >Original Message:
> > >-----------------
> > >From: Peter Welpton peter@lexandterry.com
> > >Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 10:13:42 -0500
> > >To: nas@americakicks.com
> > >Subject: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >By Ives Galarcep
> > >North Jersey Herald News/Bergen Record - Sept. 17, 2002
> > >
> > >Octavio Zambrano attempted to find the words but could only shake his
>head
> > >in disbelief. The MetroStars coach's reaction Saturday was not in
>response
> > >to the embarrassing 2-1 defeat against D.C. United, or a result of seeing
> > >his team's playoff hopes whittled down even further. Zambrano was left
> > >speechless by the actions of a player he feels is losing control.
> > >
> > >At first glance, Clint Mathis' red card expulsion from Saturday's match
> > >seemed like an isolated incident, a case of a player accidentally
>stepping
> > >on an opponent and a shaky referee pulling out a red too quickly.
>Zambrano
> > >knew better. He has seen his star player lose his head too many times to
> > >believe that Saturday's incident was a mistake, so when Zambrano heard
>that
> > >Mathis called his stepping on D.C. midfielder Jose Alegria an accident,
>the
> > >coach finally spoke out.
> > >
> > >"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put
>into
> > >words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
> > >identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs
>to
> > >deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
> > >
> > >Zambrano's comments center around Mathis' on-field demeanor, which can be
> > >best described as maniacal at times. An easy-going and affable person off
> > >the field, Mathis switches from Dr. Jeckyl to Mr. Hyde on the field, with
> > >the soccer ball serving as his full moon. He rails on officials, berates
> > >teammates and challenges opponents with taunts and the occasional push or
> > >smack in the face. Zambrano has seen such behavior from Mathis since
> > >drafting him in for Los Angeles in 1998 but has apparently grown tired of
> > >it. When a reporter suggested that Mathis' behavior was simply a result
>of
> > >his competitive nature, Zambrano curses the notion.
> > >
> > >"I love him, I really do, but he needs to realize that he just can't
>behave
> > >the way he does," said Zambrano. "We care about him too much to let him
>get
> > >away with acting this way. We have to address this issue in the
>off-season
> > >with a severity and a compassion that it deserves."
> > >
> > >Mathis thinks Zambrano brought the issue up to motivate him.
> > >
> > >"Octavio believes there is a problem there and the only reason he is
> > >bringing it up publicly is to get my attention," said Mathis. "That's
>fine.
> > >We'll do whatever we have to do to fix it."
> > >
> > >Temperamental soccer players are nothing new. The stories of Roy Keane's
> > >persona, both on and off the field, have been well chronicled. But unlike
> > >Keane, who is as irascible out of uniform as he is in uniform, Mathis is
> > >not. Off the pitch he is one of the friendliest players on the team,
>always
> > >willing to chauffeur around new teammates and address the media after the
> > >toughest of losses. On the field he transforms into a screamer, and some
> > >would even say a dirty player, who earned a red card in his very first
>MLS
> > >match. Zambrano admitted addressing the issue of Mathis' behavior with
>U.S.
> > >national team coach Bruce Arena as far back as three years ago, and
> > >suggested that it may have played a part in Mathis starting only one game
>at
> > >the World Cup.
> > >
> > >"I don't know if Bruce remembers it, but we had that discussion back then
> > >and I think it came to a head at the World Cup," Zambrano said. "The
>issues
> > >about his behavior, his training habits, these are things that became an
> > >issue and will continue to be a problem for Clint until he owns up to it
>and
> > >does something about it."
> > >
> > >There are statistics to support Zambrano's assertions. While Saturday's
>red
> > >card was the first Mathis had received since 1999, the all-star
>accumulated
> > >six yellow cards with the Metros in 2000 and 2001. He did not do much
>better
> > >with the national team, leading all players on total cards earned from
>2001
> > >to 2002 (six yellows and one red).
> > >
> > >Some will say his antics have also rubbed off on his teammates. Brazilian
> > >forward Rodrigo Faria has continued his goal scoring success from last
>year,
> > >but he has also increased the amount of arguing with referees. Zambrano
> > >addressed the team's behavior toward referees before Saturday's match,
>which
> > >made Mathis' red card that much harder to swallow.
> > >
> > >What can the Metros do?
> > >
> > >Not much if Mathis doesn't agree that he has a problem. The team will
> > >already have its hands full negotiating with Mathis, whose MLS contract
> > >expires after the 2003 season. The Georgia native has already stated that
>he
> > >is ready to sign with a European club during next MLS season if MLS
>doesn't
> > >speed up it's contract talks. The anger management issues could become a
> > >stumbling block in negotiations, especially if the Metros suggest some
>sort
> > >of monetary penalty for cards Mathis receives. The talk of bad behavior
> > >could also be an attempt to scare away potential suitors. Whatever the
>case,
> > >Zambrano was at least right in one statement. Mathis cannot spend more
>time
> > >arguing than playing, and more importantly he cannot afford to continue
> > >receiving cards. Even he would not argue with that.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 11:34:49 2002
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From: "Chris Allen" <csallen@charter.net>
To: <nas@americakicks.com>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:33:37 -0400
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
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On 16 Sep 2002 at 21:48, Bill Quigley wrote:
> At 07:46 PM 9/16/2002 -0700, Jay Hipps wrote:
> >Somebody at MLS spent a lot of time putting this together...
>
>
> Reminds me of the NFL playoff scenarios that you see in the papers late in
> the season.
I'm still waiting for an explantion for why it's not: 1) Points, 2) Goal Diff,
and 3) Goals Scored. Period.
Chris Allen
csallen@charter.net
http://webpages.charter.net/csallen/soccer.htm
-
"Comrades, we always said it was a 5 year plan"
--NE Rev Fanzine "Pictures of Chairman Mao (1996-2001)
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 11:36:36 2002
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From: RichieAnimal@cs.com
Message-ID: <22.2eef84df.2ab8d036@cs.com>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:36:38 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: dallan@netcarrier.com, nas@americakicks.com
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In a message dated 9/17/2002 2:08:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
dallan@netcarrier.com writes:
> Now as to putting Ted Chronopolous up top, what the heck was Oz thinking???
I think the worst part of OZ coaching comes out when he makes a substitution.
The only reason to sub at that level is to improve team performance. I think
Faria wastes a lot of chances but he can score, and he has very good
endurance he can go the whole game and extra time as well. Why was he taken
out? Maybe, he was hurt :-)
Richie
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/17/2002 2:08:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dallan@netcarrier.com writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Now as to putting Ted Chronopolous up top, what the heck was Oz thinking???</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>I think the worst part of OZ coaching comes out when he makes a substitution. The only reason to sub at that level is to improve team performance. I think Faria wastes a lot of chances but he can score, and he has very good endurance he can go the whole game and extra time as well. Why was he taken out? Maybe, he was hurt :-)
<BR>
<BR>Richie</FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 13:03:40 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:03:45 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jim Goloboy <goloboy@uiuc.edu>
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Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
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On Tue, 17 Sep 2002, Chris Allen wrote:
> On 16 Sep 2002 at 21:48, Bill Quigley wrote:
>
> > At 07:46 PM 9/16/2002 -0700, Jay Hipps wrote:
> > >Somebody at MLS spent a lot of time putting this together...
> >
> >
> > Reminds me of the NFL playoff scenarios that you see in the papers late in
> > the season.
>
> I'm still waiting for an explantion for why it's not: 1) Points, 2)
> Goal Diff, and 3) Goals Scored.
My guesses would be:
1. Unbalanced schedule makes goal differential less useful (Of course it
also has the same effect on points).
2. Goal differential might be easier to manipulate (teams may find it
advantageous to intentionally allow goals to affect the playoff seeding
and face an opponent of their choice).
3. That's how the other leagues here do it.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 14:11:09 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:11:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rick Mangi <rmangi@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: RichieAnimal@cs.com, peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
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--- RichieAnimal@cs.com wrote:
>
>
> Have a problem with a player take him a side
> privately, and talk to him about
> it. You don't say anything about one of your players
> to the press that could
> hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
Tell that to Arena.
__________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 14:14:33 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 17:11:27 -0400
To: Rick Mangi <rmangi@yahoo.com>,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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Why Arena?
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 02:11 PM 9/17/02 -0700, Rick Mangi wrote:
>--- RichieAnimal@cs.com wrote:
> >
> >
> > Have a problem with a player take him a side
> > privately, and talk to him about
> > it. You don't say anything about one of your players
> > to the press that could
> > hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
>
>Tell that to Arena.
>
>__________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
>http://finance.yahoo.com
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 14:19:27 2002
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From: "Keith Bundy" <kdaleb@wsu.edu>
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 17:19:01 -0400
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Because he took Mathis to task in the press for his general lack of
professionalism before the World Cup.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Niall Swan" <nialls@rcn.com>
> Why Arena?
> At 02:11 PM 9/17/02 -0700, Rick Mangi wrote:
>
> >--- RichieAnimal@cs.com wrote:
> > >
> > > Have a problem with a player take him a side
> > > privately, and talk to him about
> > > it. You don't say anything about one of your players
> > > to the press that could
> > > hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
> >
> >Tell that to Arena.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 14:19:52 2002
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:16:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rick Mangi <rmangi@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>, nas@americakicks.com
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Um... remember that little tourney in Japan/Korea?
--- Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com> wrote:
> Why Arena?
>
>
> > > Have a problem with a player take him a side
> > > privately, and talk to him about
> > > it. You don't say anything about one of your
> players
> > > to the press that could
> > > hurt the player. All the press want is a story.
> >
> >Tell that to Arena.
> >
> >____________
__________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 15:23:53 2002
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From: RichieAnimal@cs.com
Message-ID: <6f.2dd4b050.2ab9056a@cs.com>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:23:38 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: nialls@rcn.com, rmangi@yahoo.com, nas@americakicks.com
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In a message dated 9/17/2002 5:15:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nialls@rcn.com
writes:
> Why Arena?
>
Because Arena was another one who liked to tell stories about players to the
press.
But it is possible that Arena did tell Mathis first before he mentioned it to
the press. Plus telling the press about Mathis being out of shape is very
different that saying the player needed mental help.
Richie
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/17/2002 5:15:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nialls@rcn.com writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Why Arena?
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Because Arena was another one who liked to tell stories about players to the press.
<BR>
<BR>But it is possible that Arena did tell Mathis first before he mentioned it to the press. Plus telling the press about Mathis being out of shape is very different that saying the player needed mental help.
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>Richie</FONT></HTML>
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Subject: [nas] Balboa activated from IR for Metro's
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Subject: [nas] Man .U resechedule US tour
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To: <RichieAnimal@cs.com>, "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
References: <6f.2dd4b050.2ab9056a@cs.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 22:03:26 -0400
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All I ever remember Arena saying was that Mathis was not fit. That =
could mean, in "coachspeak", that he had a nagging injury and was not =
at his best.
----- Original Message -----=20
From: RichieAnimal@cs.com=20
To: nialls@rcn.com ; rmangi@yahoo.com ; nas@americakicks.com=20
Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 6:23 PM
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
In a message dated 9/17/2002 5:15:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, =
nialls@rcn.com writes:=20
Why Arena?=20
Because Arena was another one who liked to tell stories about players =
to the press.=20
But it is possible that Arena did tell Mathis first before he =
mentioned it to the press. Plus telling the press about Mathis being out =
of shape is very different that saying the player needed mental help.=20
Richie=20
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>All I ever remember Arena saying was =
that Mathis=20
was not fit. That could mean, in "coachspeak", that he had a =
nagging=20
injury and was not at his best.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A title=3DRichieAnimal@cs.com=20
href=3D"mailto:RichieAnimal@cs.com";>RichieAnimal@cs.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3Dnialls@rcn.com=20
href=3D"mailto:nialls@rcn.com";>nialls@rcn.com</A> ; <A =
title=3Drmangi@yahoo.com=20
href=3D"mailto:rmangi@yahoo.com";>rmangi@yahoo.com</A> ; <A=20
title=3Dnas@americakicks.com=20
href=3D"mailto:nas@americakicks.com";>nas@americakicks.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, September 17, =
2002 6:23=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [nas] Mathis Gone=20
Mental?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>In a =
message dated=20
9/17/2002 5:15:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time, <A=20
href=3D"mailto:nialls@rcn.com";>nialls@rcn.com</A> writes: <BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"=20
TYPE=3D"CITE">Why Arena? <BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 face=3DArial =
color=3D#000000=20
size=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></FONT><FONT lang=3D0 =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#000000 size=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF"><BR>Because Arena was =
another one who=20
liked to tell stories about players to the press. <BR><BR>But it is =
possible=20
that Arena did tell Mathis first before he mentioned it to the press. =
Plus=20
telling the press about Mathis being out of shape is very different =
that=20
saying the player needed mental help. <BR><BR><BR>Richie</FONT>=20
</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 22:06:12 2002
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Message-ID: <3D880E76.5B24688D@alumni.calpoly.edu>
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 22:26:14 -0700
From: Noah Elliott <noah97@alumni.calpoly.edu>
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To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] MLS Playoff Scenarios
References: <A1EEACA8-C9E7-11D6-8A92-0030655870FC@wordsandgraphics.com> <3D873D41.28101.1A3502A2@localhost>
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Chris Allen wrote:
>
>
> I'm still waiting for an explantion for why it's not: 1) Points, 2) Goal Diff,
> and 3) Goals Scored. Period.
> Chris Allen
Because MLS wants to be like Spain and the Champions League.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 22:30:32 2002
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Tue, 17 Sep 2002 22:30:41 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 22:33:06 -0700
From: Warren Van Orden <warrenvo@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
To: nas@americakicks.com
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In very different ways we have clearly seen both Arena and "OZ" go =
public with rather strong criticisms of Mathis.
Two very different coaches. =20
Remember Arena essetially was publicly calling Clint out as lazy when he =
siad he wasn't working hard enough to get back in shape. Arena seems to =
be usually sucessful and motivating his players, and it is rare to hear =
him speak badly..or even particularly critically...of anyone on his =
teams. He must have carefully decided that all his efforts out of the =
spotlight had failed, and maybe a little bit of public embarassment was =
worth trying as a last resort. He must have thought Clint really needed =
a kick in the butt if he was going to get back in shape.
I, too, think it's rather extraordinary to hear a coach go public about =
a player clearly needs professional help in dealing with his mental =
state. But doesn't it seem likely that OZ is right?
The debate about whether OZ (or Bruce) behaved professionally is a minor =
point compared to whatever is up with Clint. I doubt it is a trivial =
issue.
One wonders whether a bit of craziness was necessary to drive Clint to =
the level of excellence he achieved, particularly prior to his June 2001 =
injury, or whether fame and public acclaim are enough to make one a bit =
crazy.
What was his pre MLS history? Is is a blip, or is he a total head case? =
Can any of us on the outside even have a clue?
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>In very different ways we have clearly =
seen both=20
Arena and "OZ" go public with rather strong criticisms of =
Mathis.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Two very different coaches. =
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Remember Arena essetially was publicly =
calling=20
Clint out as lazy when he siad he wasn't working hard enough to get back =
in=20
shape. Arena seems to be usually sucessful and motivating his =
players, and=20
it is rare to hear him speak badly..or even particularly critically...of =
anyone=20
on his teams. He must have carefully decided that all his efforts =
out of=20
the spotlight had failed, and maybe a little bit of public embarassment =
was=20
worth trying as a last resort. He must have thought Clint really =
needed a=20
kick in the butt if he was going to get back in shape.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I, too, think it's rather extraordinary =
to hear a=20
coach go public about a player clearly needs professional help in =
dealing with=20
his mental state. But doesn't it seem likely that OZ is=20
right?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The debate about whether OZ (or Bruce) =
behaved=20
professionally is a minor point compared to whatever is up with=20
Clint. I doubt it is a trivial issue.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>One wonders whether a bit of craziness =
was=20
necessary to drive Clint to the level of excellence he achieved, =
particularly=20
prior to his June 2001 injury, or whether fame and public acclaim =
are=20
enough to make one a bit crazy.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>What was his pre MLS history? Is =
is a blip,=20
or is he a total head case? Can any of us on the outside even have =
a=20
clue?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Tue Sep 17 23:39:01 2002
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From: "Kevin Lindstrom" <klindstr@flash.net>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
References: <0.1700003034.1701942914-1463747838-1032318856@topica.com>
Subject: [nas] "Move the final" indeed.
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 01:31:30 -0500
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----- Original Message -----
From: Kevin Lindstrom <klindstr@flash.net>
> As a heads up to the list, our good friend from Los Angeles, Dan Looney is
> doing his tremendous work for CyberSoccer. Take a look.
>
> http://cybersoccernews.com/columnists/loney/020912loney.shtml
>
My response....
>
> Dear Dan,
>
> Well, let me say that I am a bit confused. I appreciate the comments
about
> Jeffries and the Cup -- going into the Week from Hell, we all wanted him
to
> do exactly what he did. We just didn't think we'd get smoked in all the
> games. And few if any fault him for the decision to play the kids in
> Denver -- although we do kind of fault him for once again coming up short
in
> big games. And I think one of the things that killed our morale was that
we
> came so close to winning that game in Colorado. And yes, Mr. Titus ought
> not to walk the streets of Dallas alone anytime soon, although I would
only
> state to him that they needed 87 of 90 minutes to beat a bunch of
rookies...
>
> But then you turn around after praising the move by Jeffries to respect
the
> Cup, and then ask for LA to host the final? How many games has LA played
in
> the USOC outside Cali? And how fair is that? Granted, LA has a good
> argument being the holders at least being the top seed throughout the
> tournament, but it seems to me that the best thing for the tradition of
the
> USOC would be to spread the wealth. IMHO, the final should be in
Columbus,
> whether the Crew are in it or not.
>
> It is the Lamar Hunt USOC, and there is no bigger stage in MLS for Lamar
> than Crew Stadium. It is centrally located so people can make the games
> from either coast in somewhat relative ease. I know -- I drove with a van
> full of Infernites to the 97 USOC in Indiana from Dallas on a Wednesday
> night in what I believe to be the only MLS-related post-championship-win
> pitch invasion.
>
> As the Right Honorable Gentleman from Fort Worth, Mr. Parrish Glover,
stated
> recently, "the Open Cup is for 'Us,' the hard core. It is our secret
party
> where we get to have the stadiums to ourselves and to have an effect on
the
> game." For now, attendance isn't what is as important as giving the
> die-hards their addiction, pure, unrefined, uncut. I loved hearing that
> lower division teams hate playing MLS clubs mostly because of the ribbing
> they get from the stands.
>
> As such, the USOC should be as accessible to as many as possible. LA
> hosting another game would do a disservice to the Cup as a whole. Sure, I
> agree that the game should be on a weekend if at all possible, but push it
> back a week if need be, but don't give LA another home game -- it already
> appears like the Fed is trying to give the Gals an undue advantage. Why
add
> to it?
>
> So Sez Drummer Boy
> http://flashpages.prodigy.net/klindstr/home.html
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 04:07:17 2002
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Message-ID: <25.2daa2e3d.2ab9b860@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:07:12 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental? (or has Zambrano?)
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In a message dated 9/17/2002 11:20:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
peter@lexandterry.com writes:
> "Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
> words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
> identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
> deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
>
It's not just Clint who needs "professional" help the entire MetroStars' team
needs professional help. They need a professional coach! In may opinion
Clint's erratic behavior is only a symptom of a greater problem, that of a
coach who while he may know his "X's" and "O's" leaves much to be desired in
other areas.
Anyone who watches the MetroStars on a semi-regular basis, can tell you that
that team lacks any degree of discipline, and self-control. It is the
coaches job to decide on a strategy, based on his and his players abilities,
and then to provide them with the direction, encouragement, and yes,
discipline to get the team to act as a cohesive unit. The MetroStars have
drifted so far away from being a cohesive unit that it appears that there is
no way back for them. No way back, with many of the current players, who are
now openly bickering with one another, or the current coaching staff.
A "professional" coach would certainly not question one of his players mental
state in the media!
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/17/2002 11:20:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, peter@lexandterry.com writes:
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">"Clint needs help, professional help," said Zambrano, who could not put into
<BR>words what is wrong with Mathis. "I am not professionally qualified to
<BR>identify what is wrong with him but Clint has some issues that he needs to
<BR>deal with and we as a team need to deal with once the season is over."
<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>It's not just Clint who needs "professional" help the entire MetroStars' team needs professional help. They need a professional coach! In may opinion Clint's erratic behavior is only a symptom of a greater problem, that of a coach who while he may know his "X's" and "O's" leaves much to be desired in other areas.
<BR>Anyone who watches the MetroStars on a semi-regular basis, can tell you that that team lacks any degree of discipline, and self-control. It is the coaches job to decide on a strategy, based on his and his players abilities, and then to provide them with the direction, encouragement, and yes, discipline to get the team to act as a cohesive unit. The MetroStars have drifted so far away from being a cohesive unit that it appears that there is no way back for them. No way back, with many of the current players, who are now openly bickering with one another, or the current coaching staff.
<BR>A "professional" coach would certainly not question one of his players mental state in the media!
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></P></P></P></FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 04:14:46 2002
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From: TheWizardofld@aol.com
Message-ID: <1be.dac8fee.2ab9ba2a@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:14:50 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental? (Arena)
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In a message dated 9/17/2002 6:32:20 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
RichieAnimal@cs.com writes:
> Because Arena was another one who liked to tell stories about players to the
>
"Telling stories" about players, or even questioning a players desire,
ability, or competence, is much different than questioning his mental health!
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/17/2002 6:32:20 PM Eastern Daylight Time, RichieAnimal@cs.com writes:
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Because Arena was another one who liked to tell stories about players to the press. </BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>"Telling stories" about players, or even questioning a players desire, ability, or competence, is much different than questioning his mental health!
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></P></P></P></FONT></HTML>
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From: TheWizardofld@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:59:18 EDT
Subject: [nas] Has Tam Ramos been a detriment to the MLS?
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I wanted to wait a days until all the acculations about Tab, his wonderful
career, and his wonderful contributions to the world of soccer have subsided.
While Tab has demonstrated that he does have wonderful ball skills, a
superior knowledge of the game, and terrific vision on the field. I think
that as far as the MLS and the MetroStars are concerned he may have been more
detrimental than a benefit.
It is a fact, that Tab has played in less than one half of the games that he
could have.
And while in many of those games he demonstrate superior abilities, in many
more games he did not. In fact, while Tab could have used his recognizably,
to set an example for the newer players in the league, and the kids watching
at home or at the game, we often saw a "hot headed, cry baby" instead.
Just as damaging to the Metro, and the MLS is the fact that while Tab was a
memeber of the MetroStars, his roster spot in his salary prevented the league
and the MLS from signing other players who could have contributed more to the
league and the team. Let's face it while Tab does bring a certain amount of
"recognizablity" to the league, what good does it do if he is never there?
For all of Tab's "recognizablity" players like Mike Petke, Richie Wiliams,
and Demarcus Beasley, have done more for the MLS, with their presence on the
pitch than Tab has done.
If you doubt that other players have contributed more to the health of the
MLS, all you have to do is walk around Giant's Stadium and look at the
jerseys that the young kids are wearing. They are wearing Mike Petke, Clint
Mathis, and Timmy Howard jerseys.
I do not wish Tab Ramos ill, but I for one will certainly not lament his
departure.
The King is Dead, long live the King
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>I wanted to wait a days until all the acculations about Tab, his wonderful career, and his wonderful contributions to the world of soccer have subsided.
<BR>
<BR>While Tab has demonstrated that he does have wonderful ball skills, a superior knowledge of the game, and terrific vision on the field. I think that as far as the MLS and the MetroStars are concerned he may have been more detrimental than a benefit.
<BR>
<BR>It is a fact, that Tab has played in less than one half of the games that he could have.
<BR>And while in many of those games he demonstrate superior abilities, in many more games he did not. In fact, while Tab could have used his recognizably, to set an example for the newer players in the league, and the kids watching at home or at the game, we often saw a "hot headed, cry baby" instead.
<BR>
<BR>Just as damaging to the Metro, and the MLS is the fact that while Tab was a memeber of the MetroStars, his roster spot in his salary prevented the league and the MLS from signing other players who could have contributed more to the league and the team. Let's face it while Tab does bring a certain amount of "recognizablity" to the league, what good does it do if he is never there? For all of Tab's "recognizablity" players like Mike Petke, Richie Wiliams, and Demarcus Beasley, have done more for the MLS, with their presence on the pitch than Tab has done.
<BR>
<BR>If you doubt that other players have contributed more to the health of the MLS, all you have to do is walk around Giant's Stadium and look at the jerseys that the young kids are wearing. They are wearing Mike Petke, Clint Mathis, and Timmy Howard jerseys.
<BR>
<BR>I do not wish Tab Ramos ill, but I for one will certainly not lament his departure.
<BR>
<BR>The King is Dead, long live the King
<BR>
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></P></P></P></FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 07:05:05 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 09:05:25 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: [nas] That's gotta hurt
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
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Hadnt seen this discussed on the list...
Richard Mulrooney is out for the season for the Quakes with a broken ankle!
That will put a dent in their hopes to repeat as he is an unsung hero for
that squad. I can't think off the top of my head who would fill is spot...
peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 07:26:08 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:26:06 -0700
From: Jay Hipps <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] That's gotta hurt
In-reply-to: <00a901c25f1c$6f81dd60$6501a8c0@d0h9901>
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My guess is that they'll move Corrales to d-mid, Lagos to the left, and
insert Ian Russell on the right. Corrales is having the best season of
his career and has filled in for Richard before, so they're at least
treading on familiar ground. Losing Mulrooney will hurt but it may also
provide a rallying point for the team.
I find it amazing that Mulrooney broke his ankle at some point during
the match against LA last Saturday but still played the full 90.
Jay
On Wednesday, September 18, 2002, at 07:05 AM, Peter Welpton wrote:
> Hadnt seen this discussed on the list...
>
> Richard Mulrooney is out for the season for the Quakes with a broken
> ankle!
> That will put a dent in their hopes to repeat as he is an unsung hero
> for
> that squad. I can't think off the top of my head who would fill is
> spot...
>
> peet
>
>
> ---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 07:29:01 2002
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Subject: [nas] FW: Heinrichs Names 28 to Train for 2002 Nike U.S. Women's Cup
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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HEINRICHS NAMES 28 TO TRAIN FOR 2002 NIKE U.S. WOMEN'S CUP; U.S. WILL FACE
RUSSIA, ITALY AND AUSTRALIA IN N.Y. AND N.C.
Heinrichs Will Choose 18 for Tournament as USA Defends Perfect Record
CHICAGO (Tuesday, September 17, 2002) - U.S. Women's National Team head
coach April Heinrichs has named 28 players to train for four days in Long
Island, N.Y., before the USA opens the 2002 Nike U.S. Women's Cup against
Russia at the Mitchel Athletic Complex on Sept. 29 at 4 p.m. ET in a match
presented by Philips Electronics.
Continue: http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=22136
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<TT>HEINRICHS NAMES 28 TO TRAIN FOR 2002 NIKE U.S. WOMEN'S CUP; U.S. WILL F=
ACE RUSSIA, ITALY AND AUSTRALIA IN N.Y. AND N.C.<BR>
<BR>
Heinrichs Will Choose 18 for Tournament as USA Defends Perfect Record<BR>
<BR>
CHICAGO (Tuesday, September 17, 2002) - U.S. Women's National Team head coa=
ch April Heinrichs has named 28 players to train for four days in Long Islan=
d, N.Y., before the USA opens the 2002 Nike U.S. Women's Cup against Russia =
at the Mitchel Athletic Complex on Sept. 29 at 4 p.m. ET in a match presente=
d by Philips Electronics.<BR>
<BR>
Continue: http://www.ussoccer.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=3D22136<BR>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 07:32:55 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:33:58 -0700
Subject: [nas] USL/MLS Affiliation not being renewed?
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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FYI from Pallo.
----------
From: Mark Pallo <mpallo@rhinopit.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:42:16 -0400
Subject: USL/MLS Affiliation?
"Major League Soccer's partnership with the United Soccer Leagues, in
effect since 1996, will not be renewed. This is the final year of a
four-year contract that designates USL teams as official affiliates of
MLS teams and generates some income for A-League members who lose
contracted players to MLS."
The Kickers, for example, received about $27,000 from a designated
$250,000 pool when Dwayne DeRosario signed with the San Jose Earthquakes
last year. Richmond expects to receive a larger amount for goalie Mike
McGinty, signed by D.C. United this year.
"They [MLS] just aren't interested in going forward," said Kickers
General Manager Billy Hallock.
Soccer Notes - Richmond Times-Dispatch
http://www.timesdispatch.com/sports/localpros/kickers/MGBJDRFL86D.html
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FYI from Pallo.<BR>
----------<BR>
<B>From: </B>Mark Pallo <mpallo@rhinopit.com><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:42:16 -0400<BR>
<B>Subject: </B>USL/MLS Affiliation?<BR>
<BR>
<TT>"Major League Soccer's partnership with the United Soccer Leagues,=
in<BR>
effect since 1996, will not be renewed. This is the final year of a<BR>
four-year contract that designates USL teams as official affiliates of<BR>
MLS teams and generates some income for A-League members who lose<BR>
contracted players to MLS."<BR>
<BR>
The Kickers, for example, received about $27,000 from a designated<BR>
$250,000 pool when Dwayne DeRosario signed with the San Jose Earthquakes<BR=
>
last year. Richmond expects to receive a larger amount for goalie Mike<BR>
McGinty, signed by D.C. United this year.<BR>
<BR>
"They [MLS] just aren't interested in going forward," said Kicker=
s<BR>
General Manager Billy Hallock.<BR>
<BR>
Soccer Notes - Richmond Times-Dispatch<BR>
http://www.timesdispatch.com/sports/localpros/kickers/MGBJDRFL86D.html<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
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Subject: RE: [nas] USL/MLS Affiliation not being renewed?
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Interesting=2E Wonder what kind of system will replace this, if any? Does=
this mean that the MLS teams may start up their own true reserve squads?=20=
Original Message:
-----------------
From: big_dog@fastmail=2Efm
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:33:58 -0700
To: NAS@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: [nas] USL/MLS Affiliation not being renewed?
FYI from Pallo=2E
----------
From: Mark Pallo <mpallo@rhinopit=2Ecom>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:42:16 -0400
Subject: USL/MLS Affiliation?
"Major League Soccer's partnership with the United Soccer Leagues, in
effect since 1996, will not be renewed=2E This is the final year of a
four-year contract that designates USL teams as official affiliates of
MLS teams and generates some income for A-League members who lose
contracted players to MLS=2E"
The Kickers, for example, received about $27,000 from a designated
$250,000 pool when Dwayne DeRosario signed with the San Jose Earthquakes
last year=2E Richmond expects to receive a larger amount for goalie Mike
McGinty, signed by D=2EC=2E United this year=2E
"They [MLS] just aren't interested in going forward," said Kickers
General Manager Billy Hallock=2E
Soccer Notes - Richmond Times-Dispatch
http://www=2Etimesdispatch=2Ecom/sports/localpros/kickers/MGBJDRFL86D=2Eht=
ml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 07:54:32 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:55:36 -0700
Subject: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
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http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:59:01 -0700 (PDT)
From: PETER V GRATTON <grattonp@unlv.edu>
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Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental? (or has Zambrano?)
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On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 TheWizardofld@aol.com wrote:
<snip> It's not just Clint who needs "professional" help the entire
>MetroStars' team needs professional help. They need a professional
> coach! In my opinion Clint's erratic behavior is only a symptom of a
> greater problem, that of a coach who while he may know his "X's" and
> "O's" leaves much to be desired in other areas.
> Anyone who watches the MetroStars on a semi-regular basis, can tell you that
> that team lacks any degree of discipline, and self-control. It is the
> coaches job to decide on a strategy, based on his and his players abilities,
> and then to provide them with the direction, encouragement, and yes,
> discipline to get the team to act as a cohesive unit. The MetroStars have
> drifted so far away from being a cohesive unit that it appears that there is
> no way back for them. No way back, with many of the current players, who are
> now openly bickering with one another, or the current coaching staff.
> A "professional" coach would certainly not question one of his players mental
> state in the media!
IMHO, Clint is probably one of the vocal opposition to OZ. I wouldn't be
surprised that this was Coach speak to say Clint has a Bad Attitude.
However as several people have pointed out the TEAM is cracked apart and
a NEW Coach is the Only solution short of wholesale trades. For those of us
who have coached, we know sometimes the Coach takes the fall for player
performance and sometimes the TEAM takes the blame for Coach performance.
This seems to be the TEAM taking one for the Coach's lack of team
building ability. Sometimes all it takes it to trade a problem player or
bring in what the team lacks in leadership. While WE don't know all the
details, it sure looks like OZ didn't do what it would take to build a
TEAM and as has been pointed out he doesn't change during the game or sub
well. At least, he doesn't seem to get the desired result.
I will say after 30+ years of coaching young players [4-21] that
sometimes you as the coach just can't reach the players enough to get the
desired results. Usually the one or two Critical players will not respond
for you but as a Pro Coach it means trade time.
Peter Gratton
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:05:06 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:05:26 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
Reply-to: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
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> http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?
Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football.
let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:11:57 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:08:52 -0400
To: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA
rankings
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Hmm - Holland and Spain are quite high given their history of
underachievement Holland did not even qualify for the world cup. Australia
is ranked 17 ahead of the US. Ok a major boob there. It's seems in terms of
which one is better, that it's six of one, and half a dozen of the other!
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 10:05 AM 9/18/02 -0500, you wrote:
> > http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
>
>
>OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
>
>Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?
>
>Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
>currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
>
>While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football.
>
>let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
>
>peet
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:14:58 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:11:52 -0400
To: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>,nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA
rankings
In-Reply-To: <4.2.2.20020918110602.00c20b40@pop.rcn.com>
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Just to clarify my last sentence, I meant that there seems to be little
difference in the outcomes of either rating systems (I did not mean that
the US and Oz were of similar abilities).
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 11:08 AM 9/18/02 -0400, Niall Swan wrote:
>Hmm - Holland and Spain are quite high given their history of
>underachievement Holland did not even qualify for the world cup. Australia
>is ranked 17 ahead of the US. Ok a major boob there. It's seems in terms
>of which one is better, that it's six of one, and half a dozen of the other!
>
>Niall
>
>The Soccer Resort
>www.soccerresort.com
>Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
>
>
>
>
>At 10:05 AM 9/18/02 -0500, you wrote:
>
>
>> > http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
>>
>>
>>OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
>>
>>Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?
>>
>>Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
>>currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
>>
>>While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football.
>>
>>let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
>>
>>peet
>>
>>
>>---
>>NAS is hosted by America Kicks (http://www.americakicks.com)
>>To subscribe or unsubscribe: http://nas.americakicks.com
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>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:26:36 2002
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Reply-To: <mason@baselineengineers.com>
From: "Mason F. Berryman" <mason@baselineengineers.com>
To: "US Soccer List" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: RE: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:26:35 -0400
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OK, I'll bite.
Both of these (computerized, I guess) rankings have problems. I only had a
second to look at this ELO list but (in no particular order),
Holland at #2 - they didn't make the world cup
Mexico 3 spots better than the US? Not based on the last two years.
Australia at #17? Two spots above the US????
I would be interested to see something akin to the "coaches poll" that comes
out for NCAA football.
Mason
-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Welpton
> http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?
Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football.
let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
peet
---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:26:44 2002
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References: <B9ADE1F8.AB1%big_dog@fastmail.fm> <00fa01c25f24$d1b8b640$6501a8c0@d0h9901>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:15:59 -0400
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I cannot argue the point that there are more than seven teams in the world
better than the US, however, I'm not sure that there are 18 teams that are.
The only reason I concern myself with world rankings is a possible seed in
Germany... that would be wild, and it is possible (I won't do all that stats
again, though). That's why I value the FIFA rankings over Elo.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Welpton" <peter@lexandterry.com>
> >
http://sports.yahoo.com/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc.html
>
> OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long
ago.
>
> Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?
>
> Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
> currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
>
> While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football.
>
> let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
>
> peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:31:30 2002
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From: TheWizardofld@aol.com
Message-ID: <1a7.8ae2b51.2ab9f64d@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:31:25 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
To: peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
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In a message dated 9/18/2002 11:05:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
peter@lexandterry.com writes:
> OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
>
> Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH?
I dont know just how valid these rankings are, so perhaps the US can play a
couple "friendlies" against Italy and England to determine if there is any
validity to those rankings (which do count when it come to placement in the
World Cup brakets).... PLEASE!
Here in this country that is!
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/18/2002 11:05:41 AM Eastern Daylight Time, peter@lexandterry.com writes:
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ago.
<BR>
<BR>Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?</BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>I dont know just how valid these rankings are, so perhaps the US can play a couple "friendlies" against Italy and England to determine if there is any validity to those rankings (which do count when it come to placement in the World Cup brakets).... PLEASE!
<BR>Here in this country that is!
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:43:28 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:43:35 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings (also)
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I guess the South Korean bandwagon got overcrowded...... for all the hype
that they had gotten during and after the World Cup, they are still only
ranked 21st. Probably about where they belong but I am surprised not to see
them ranked a bit higher.
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>I guess the South Korean bandwagon got overcrowded...... for all the hype that they had gotten during and after the World Cup, they are still only ranked 21st. Probably about where they belong but I am surprised not to see them ranked a bit higher.
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR></P></P></P></FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:49:19 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:50:44 -0500 (CDT)
From: "James V. Geluso" <atlemar@io.com>
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
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I don't understand. We have played no games since the post-World Cup
rankings came out. England and Italy have dropped... but have they lost
games? There has only been one round of Euro 2004 qualifying... I don't
get it.
--
james geluso:atlemar@io.com:in my mind i'm everyone
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 08:53:07 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:53:13 EDT
Subject: [nas] Copa Caribe
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Is the Copa Caribe a tounament to determine which teams will be representing
that region in the Gold Cup?
Ed
"There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" -
Shakespeare
__________________________________________________________________
"Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of
them."
Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
___________________________________________________________________
"For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2>
<BR>Is the Copa Caribe a tounament to determine which teams will be representing that region in the Gold Cup?
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000080" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>Ed
<BR>
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "There's nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" - Shakespeare
<BR><P ALIGN=LEFT>__________________________________________________________________
<BR> "Men are not disturbed by things, but by the view they take of them."
<BR> Epictetus (The Enchiridion)
<BR>___________________________________________________________________
<BR><P ALIGN=CENTER> "For as he thinks within himself, so he is" Book of Proverbs (23: 7)</FONT><FONT COLOR="#0000a0" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:02:56 2002
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To: "James V. Geluso" <atlemar@io.com>
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Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
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Italy lost a friendly to Slovenia. I think England drew in a friendly with
Portugal.
"James V. Geluso" wrote:
> I don't understand. We have played no games since the post-World Cup
> rankings came out. England and Italy have dropped... but have they lost
> games? There has only been one round of Euro 2004 qualifying... I don't
> get it.
>
> --
> james geluso:atlemar@io.com:in my mind i'm everyone
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:09:58 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 09:10:04 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bill Fetty <fcfetty@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental?
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Coach Berson at South Carolina did the same thing in
the past but most of us down here took it as a bit of
a joke. Didn't happen fairly often and didn't make any
sort of ripple in the press but it was mentioned from
what I know. Clint also had a tendency to fly off the
handle a bit sometimes too but if you've ever seen the
state of refereeing in the college game then you might
be able to understand. No offense to the refs on the
list.
__________________________________________________
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Yahoo! News - Today's headlines
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:21:05 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:21:13 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jim Goloboy <goloboy@uiuc.edu>
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Subject: Re: [nas] Copa Caribe
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On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 TheWizardofld@aol.com wrote:
>
> Is the Copa Caribe a tounament to determine which teams will be representing
> that region in the Gold Cup?
It was, but has been scrapped in favor of a straight Gold Cup Qualifying
format this time. There won't be any Caribbean champion crowned as in
the past.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:28:44 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:28:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: Jim Goloboy <goloboy@uiuc.edu>
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On Wed, 18 Sep 2002, Jim Goloboy wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Sep 2002 TheWizardofld@aol.com wrote:
>
> >
> > Is the Copa Caribe a tounament to determine which teams will be representing
> > that region in the Gold Cup?
>
> It was, but has been scrapped in favor of a straight Gold Cup Qualifying
> format this time. There won't be any Caribbean champion crowned as in
> the past.
After checking the CONCACAF pages, it appears that there will indeed be a
Caribbean champion crowned. But the tournament is no longer known as the
Copa Caribe, just Caribbean Zone Gold Cup Qualifying. Not sure what this
means, except that maybe the final qualifying tournament is organzied by
CONCACAF instead of the CFU or the host nation.
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:49:08 2002
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Subject: [nas] more A-League season honors
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http://a-league.com/news/2002/news,2002,0710.shtml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 09:59:24 2002
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Reply-To: <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
From: "Timothy D. Ristorcelli" <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US Soccer News Links 09-18-02
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 13:00:10 -0400
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US Soccer News Links 09-18-02
http://www.sams-army.com/index.php/Mlist=news/Nyear=2002/Nmonth=09/Nday=18
____________________________________
Timothy D. Ristorcelli, MBA
crazo@tampabay.rr.com
Check out: http://www.sams-army.com
ICQ: 1361610
____________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 10:09:05 2002
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Subject: [nas] A-League Conference Finals preview
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http://a-league.com/news/2002/news,2002,0711.shtml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 10:16:19 2002
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Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:17:15 -0700
Subject: [nas] MLS Newslinks 9-17 (22 articles)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Survival of the fittest (post season hope alive and kicking)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/weekly0917.html
MLS Leading scorers
http://www.socceramerica.com/article.asp?Art_ID=562132236
MLS team attendance average
http://www.socceramerica.com/article.asp?Art_ID=562132237
MLS Goal scoring average
http://www.socceramerica.com/article.asp?Art_ID=562132238
MLS Injury report
http://sports.yahoo.com/mls/news/20020918/mlsinjury.html
Galaxy have resumed talks for Hong
http://www.planetfootball.com/article.asp?id=109315&cpid=218&title=Galaxy+qu
est+for+Hong
Morrow praise at Dallas
http://www.planetfootball.com/article.asp?id=109365&cpid=218&title=Morrow+pr
aise+at+Dallas
Burn v United Thursday preview
http://sports.yahoo.com/mls/news/ap/20020917/ap-mls-burn-unitedpreview.html
San Jose to face Mexican champs
http://www.planetfootball.com/article.asp?id=109366&plid=&clid=&cpid=218&tit
le=San+Jose+face+Mexican+champs
MLS Newsstand 9-18 (13 )
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0918newsstand.html
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 10:41:11 2002
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From: "Larson, Steve" <Steve.Larson@kla-tencor.com>
To: "'Jay Hipps'" <jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com>,
US Soccer List
<nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: RE: [nas] That's gotta hurt
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:41:15 -0700
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Maybe he broke it kicking the linesman in the keyster after that horrible
I'm offside by 10 yards but I still can't see it call.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Hipps [mailto:jhipps@wordsandgraphics.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2002 7:26 AM
To: US Soccer List
Subject: Re: [nas] That's gotta hurt
My guess is that they'll move Corrales to d-mid, Lagos to the left, and
insert Ian Russell on the right. Corrales is having the best season of
his career and has filled in for Richard before, so they're at least
treading on familiar ground. Losing Mulrooney will hurt but it may also
provide a rallying point for the team.
I find it amazing that Mulrooney broke his ankle at some point during
the match against LA last Saturday but still played the full 90.
Jay
On Wednesday, September 18, 2002, at 07:05 AM, Peter Welpton wrote:
> Hadnt seen this discussed on the list...
>
> Richard Mulrooney is out for the season for the Quakes with a broken
> ankle!
> That will put a dent in their hopes to repeat as he is an unsung hero
> for
> that squad. I can't think off the top of my head who would fill is
> spot...
>
> peet
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 12:17:01 2002
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Subject: Re: [nas] That's gotta hurt
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In a message dated 9/18/2002 7:32:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
peter@lexandterry.com writes:
> Richard Mulrooney is out for the season for the Quakes with a broken ankle!
> That will put a dent in their hopes to repeat as he is an unsung hero for
> that squad. I can't think off the top of my head who would fill is spot...
He's definitely an unsung hero. His spot will be hard to fill. I see it as
a lot less likely that the Quakes will win the Cup again. If we do, you can
blame Yallop. He has done an exceptional job shuffling people in and out of
the lineup due to serveral long term injuries (Goose, Dayak, Lagos, Russell)
in addition to WC call-ups. Shoe in for coach of the year if he can pull it
off one more time.
My guess is that Yallop may use this as an opportunity to get DeRosario &
Graziani into the lineup at the same time, with Donovan moving into midfield.
Either that or he'll bring Ian Russell back into the lineup in Corrales'
spot, moving Corrales into center midfield.
I'd prefer the former to the latter because Mulrooney did a lot of
distributing from his position and frankly Corrales is where good offensive
opportunities go to die. He just doesn't see teammates making runs in time.
By the time he has realized the opportunity, so has the defender and the
passing lane gets choked off, so Ramiro ends up holding it longer or passing
it backwards. When you have a team like the Quakes with explosive offensive
speed, you really need someone in the middle with vision. While Ekelund
does, Corrales does not and some of that distribution will be expected of
Corrales.
Darrin
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">In a message dated 9/18/2002 7:32:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, peter@lexandterry.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Richard Mulrooney is out for the season for the Quakes with a broken ankle!<BR>
That will put a dent in their hopes to repeat as he is an unsung hero for<BR>
that squad. I can't think off the top of my head who would fill is spot...</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
He's definitely an unsung hero. His spot will be hard to fill. I see it as a lot less likely that the Quakes will win the Cup again. If we do, you can blame Yallop. He has done an exceptional job shuffling people in and out of the lineup due to serveral long term injuries (Goose, Dayak, Lagos, Russell) in addition to WC call-ups. Shoe in for coach of the year if he can pull it off one more time.<BR>
<BR>
My guess is that Yallop may use this as an opportunity to get DeRosario & Graziani into the lineup at the same time, with Donovan moving into midfield. Either that or he'll bring Ian Russell back into the lineup in Corrales' spot, moving Corrales into center midfield. <BR>
<BR>
I'd prefer the former to the latter because Mulrooney did a lot of distributing from his position and frankly Corrales is where good offensive opportunities go to die. He just doesn't see teammates making runs in time. By the time he has realized the opportunity, so has the defender and the passing lane gets choked off, so Ramiro ends up holding it longer or passing it backwards. When you have a team like the Quakes with explosive offensive speed, you really need someone in the middle with vision. While Ekelund does, Corrales does not and some of that distribution will be expected of Corrales.<BR>
<BR>
Darrin</FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 12:24:09 2002
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From: "Chris Allen" <csallen@charter.net>
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On 17 Sep 2002 at 15:03, Jim Goloboy wrote:
> > I'm still waiting for an explantion for why it's not: 1) Points, 2)
> > Goal Diff, and 3) Goals Scored.
> My guesses would be:
> 1. Unbalanced schedule makes goal differential less useful (Of course it
> also has the same effect on points).
But not all teams play each other the same number of times now.
Teams within divisions play each other 4x each. Outside the division
it's just 2x each.
> 2. Goal differential might be easier to manipulate (teams may find it
> advantageous to intentionally allow goals to affect the playoff seeding
> and face an opponent of their choice).
Why is that any more difficult than a team playing for a draw to get the
7th position so they would have to face Columbus, New England, or
Metros and not either LA or San Jose?
> 3. That's how the other leagues here do it.
So, we are left with the "failure of imagination" explanation. The same
"logic" that still insists on a "Best of 3 (sort of)" playoff system. My God,
even the USL -- the poster child of tweaking soccer laws under
Francisco Marcos' leadership -- has finally realized that a 2 leg (total
goal) playoff system is the best way to go.
Cheers, Chris
Chris Allen
csallen@charter.net
http://webpages.charter.net/csallen/soccer.htm
-
"Comrades, we always said it was a 5 year plan"
--NE Rev Fanzine "Pictures of Chairman Mao (1996-2001)
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Wed Sep 18 23:43:52 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 01:41:02 -0500
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
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OK, I'll take the bait. I'm sure my argument will be especially reviled
since I didn't pay attention to the "major debate" earlier. Sorry.
But, we just had a World Cup, and basically nothing has happened since
then. And we got 8th place. Ergo, we are the 8th best team in the
world. That's the end of the story, at least until some international
matches start happening. You prove your worth on the field of play, and
that's exactly what we did. This isn't even debatable. Furthermore,
Turkey should be the #3 team in the world behind Germany, and just ahead
of S. Korea. I mean, the whole point of the World Cup is to be the ONE
tournament for the national teams to prove on the field how they stand
against all others.
I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are generally realistic at
all, but they got lucky in this case and put us exactly where we
belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be ranked #2 right now as it
was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind Brazil in the rankings
immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil by 3 goals. Mexico
being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't be behind us.
My argument here is so fundamental and un-original that somebody has
surely already made the point.
...and yes, I think college football should have a playoff.
Lark
On Wednesday, September 18, 2002, at 10:05 AM, Peter Welpton wrote:
>
> OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long
> ago.
>
> Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and
> Italy?
>
> Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
> currently has the US at 19th. http://www.eloratings.net
>
> While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International
> Football.
>
> let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
>
> peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 00:49:12 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 03:49:14 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
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In a message dated 9/18/2002 11:44:48 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
larkho@ghgcorp.com writes:
> But, we just had a World Cup, and basically nothing has happened since
> then. And we got 8th place. Ergo, we are the 8th best team in the
> world. That's the end of the story, at least until some international
> matches start happening.
I disagree with this completely. I think the idea behind the rankings (and
how they should calculate it is endlessly debatable) is to show who
"generally" the best teams are. The old rule in baseball (or I guess new
rule since the wildcard is relatively new) is that in a short playoff series,
anything can happen. The best team does not always win because the best team
might run into some bumps and not play well. But in a longer series, the
cream will tend to rise to the top and the better team has a better chance to
win.
Turkey is in no way the third best team in the world. They were the third
best team in the tourny, within this finite amount of time during the world
cup. But over the long haul, they are not going to beat the 4th place team
(Germany) the majority of the time. The majority of the time, Germany will
win those games. Hence Germany being higher up.
On a side note, these rankings will become even more muddled I believe. The
gap between the elite teams and the up-and-comers is getting smaller. So
there will be even more anomolies like Spain in 2nd place and, yes, the U.S.
in 8th. Unless the world's teams played a balanced schedule, with the same
roster for every game, you'll never have a truely accurate ranking of the
world's teams. In the mean time I guess it just provides discussion fodder
for us soccer geeks.
Darrin
You prove your worth on the field of play, and
>
> that's exactly what we did. This isn't even debatable. Furthermore,
> Turkey should be the #3 team in the world behind Germany, and just ahead
> of S. Korea. I mean, the whole point of the World Cup is to be the ONE
> tournament for the national teams to prove on the field how they stand
> against all others.
>
> I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are generally realistic at
> all, but they got lucky in this case and put us exactly where we
> belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be ranked #2 right now as it
> was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind Brazil in the rankings
> immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil by 3 goals. Mexico
> being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't be behind us.
>
> My argument here is so fundamental and un-original that somebody has
> surely already made the point.
>
> ...and yes, I think college football should have a playoff.
>
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/18/2002 11:44:48 PM Pacific Daylight Time, larkho@ghgcorp.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">But, we just had a World Cup, and basically nothing has happened since <BR>
then. And we got 8th place. Ergo, we are the 8th best team in the <BR>
world. That's the end of the story, at least until some international <BR>
matches start happening.</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">I disagree with this completely. I think the idea behind the rankings (and how they should calculate it is endlessly debatable) is to show who "generally" the best teams are. The old rule in baseball (or I guess new rule since the wildcard is relatively new) is that in a short playoff series, anything can happen. The best team does not always win because the best team might run into some bumps and not play well. But in a longer series, the cream will tend to rise to the top and the better team has a better chance to win.<BR>
<BR>
Turkey is in no way the third best team in the world. They were the third best team in the tourny, within this finite amount of time during the world cup. But over the long haul, they are not going to beat the 4th place team (Germany) the majority of the time. The majority of the time, Germany will win those games. Hence Germany being higher up.<BR>
<BR>
On a side note, these rankings will become even more muddled I believe. The gap between the elite teams and the up-and-comers is getting smaller. So there will be even more anomolies like Spain in 2nd place and, yes, the U.S. in 8th. Unless the world's teams played a balanced schedule, with the same roster for every game, you'll never have a truely accurate ranking of the world's teams. In the mean time I guess it just provides discussion fodder for us soccer geeks.<BR>
<BR>
Darrin<BR>
<BR>
You prove your worth on the field of play, and </FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BR>
</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0"><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"><BR>
that's exactly what we did. This isn't even debatable. Furthermore, <BR>
Turkey should be the #3 team in the world behind Germany, and just ahead <BR>
of S. Korea. I mean, the whole point of the World Cup is to be the ONE <BR>
tournament for the national teams to prove on the field how they stand <BR>
against all others.<BR>
<BR>
I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are generally realistic at <BR>
all, but they got lucky in this case and put us exactly where we <BR>
belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be ranked #2 right now as it <BR>
was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind Brazil in the rankings <BR>
immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil by 3 goals. Mexico <BR>
being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't be behind us.<BR>
<BR>
My argument here is so fundamental and un-original that somebody has <BR>
surely already made the point.<BR>
<BR>
...and yes, I think college football should have a playoff.<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
<BR>
</FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 04:58:18 2002
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From: RichieAnimal@cs.com
Message-ID: <14d.143f97c8.2abb15dd@cs.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 07:58:21 EDT
Subject: [nas] Post from someone who calls himself OZ
To: nas@americakicks.com
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I can't say for sure if the poster is THE OZ. Probably not it is too
inventive for him. This was put on a coaching list and an officiating list.
"Is there any rule against getting on a teammates shoulders for a corner
kick? This thought just came into my head kind of randomly, and now I gotta
know the answer! I want to use it in my next match a very important game. I'm
thinking this would kick ass if you got two tall people one standing on the
other ones shoulders, and an accurate guy taking the corners.
Thanks
OZ"
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">I can't say for sure if the poster is THE OZ. Probably not it is too inventive for him. This was put on a coaching list and an officiating list.
<BR>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Verdana" LANG="0">"Is there any rule against getting on a teammates shoulders for a corner kick? This thought just came into my head kind of randomly, and now I gotta know the answer! I want to use it in my next match a very important game. I'm thinking this would kick ass if you got two tall people one standing on the other ones shoulders, and an accurate guy taking the corners.
<BR>
<BR>Thanks
<BR>
<BR>OZ"</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Verdana" LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>
<BR></FONT></HTML>
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(envelope-from mpallo@rhinopit.com)(envelope-to <nas@americakicks.com>)
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:11:51 -0400
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Rochester Raging Rhinos at Richmond Kickers
By Jerry Lindquist - Richmond Times Dispatch
http://www.timesdispatch.com/sports/localpros/kickers/MGBFSSD0A6D.html
"They are under such intense scrutiny from fans and local media that
losses aren't tolerated and even wins that don't measure up to certain
standards can be subjected to ridicule. Eight regular-season losses this
year drew considerable comment as six did a year ago and nine the
previous campaign. Playing a defense-oriented style isn't the best way
to win friends, either."
"The pressure on him must be immense," said Cowlishaw, third-year coach
of the Richmond Kickers, who meet the Rhinos for the Eastern Conference
title in a two-game series starting tonight at Sports Backers Stadium.
The Kickers are coming off a rousing come-from-behind decision over
top-seeded Charleston in the second round.
"[Ercoli] wins it year in and year out, and the fans are never happy,"
Cowlishaw continued. "[The Rhinos] have mediocre regular seasons, and
their fans say they're not good enough when people who really know
what's going on realize that team can turn it on when needed - and it's
more important to turn it on in the playoffs, which is what they've
consistently done."
Rhinos' foe Richmond still kicking
By Jeff DiVeronica - Democrat and Chronicle
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/sports/rhinos/0919story1_rhinos.shtml
-Mark
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Subject: [nas] SJ v America (R)
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1-1
http://sports.yahoo.com/m/sow/news/ap/20020919/ap-clubamerica-earthquakes.ht
ml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 05:53:36 2002
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From: "Timothy D. Ristorcelli" <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
To: <RichieAnimal@cs.com>, <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: RE: [nas] Post from someone who calls himself OZ
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I can't say that it's written into the laws exactly like that, but there are
laws in the game that prevent unsportsmenlike conduct such as this. It
wouldn't be allowed, just like its not allowed to hang from the crossbar
with your arms to save a high shot in a game. Also, the rules don't say its
illegal to take off your shoe and throw it at the ball to save a shot, but
obviously these kind of things fall under the unsportsmenlike conduct rules.
If you can manage to get away with this in a game, consider yourself lucky
to have someone that doesn't quite know the rules of the game officiating.
___________________________________
Timothy D. Ristorcelli, MBA
crazo@tampabay.rr.com
ICQ: 1361610
Sam's Army: http://www.sams-army.com
___________________________________
-----Original Message-----
"Is there any rule against getting on a teammates shoulders for a corner
kick? This thought just came into my head kind of randomly, and now I gotta
know the answer! I want to use it in my next match a very important game.
I'm thinking this would kick ass if you got two tall people one standing on
the other ones shoulders, and an accurate guy taking the corners.
------=_NextPart_000_0031_01C25FBA.25E64940
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<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D510434912-19092002>I =
can't say that=20
it's written into the laws exactly like that, but there are laws in the =
game=20
that prevent unsportsmenlike conduct such as this. It wouldn't be =
allowed,=20
just like its not allowed to hang from the crossbar with your arms to =
save a=20
high shot in a game. Also, the rules don't say its illegal to take =
off=20
your shoe and throw it at the ball to save a shot, but obviously these =
kind of=20
things fall under the unsportsmenlike conduct rules.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D510434912-19092002></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D510434912-19092002>If you =
can manage to=20
get away with this in a game, consider yourself lucky to have someone =
that=20
doesn't quite know the rules of the game =
officiating.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<P><FONT size=3D2>___________________________________<BR>Timothy D. =
Ristorcelli,=20
MBA<BR>crazo@tampabay.rr.com<BR>ICQ: 1361610<BR>Sam's Army: <A=20
href=3D"http://www.sams-army.com/"=20
target=3D_blank>http://www.sams-army.com</A><BR>_________________________=
__________<BR> </FONT>=20
</P>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR></FONT><FONT =
face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT=20
lang=3D0 face=3DVerdana color=3D#000000 size=3D2 =
FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF">"Is there any rule=20
against getting on a teammates shoulders for a corner kick? This thought =
just=20
came into my head kind of randomly, and now I gotta know the answer! I =
want to=20
use it in my next match a very important game. I'm thinking this would =
kick ass=20
if you got two tall people one standing on the other ones shoulders, and =
an=20
accurate guy taking the corners. <BR></FONT></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 05:54:45 -0700
Subject: [nas] DCU v Dallas ESPN2 7:30 ET Preview
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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DCU needs to win to keep playoff hopes alive
http://www.soccertimes.com/mls/2002/sep18.htm
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 06:09:55 2002
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From: RichieAnimal@cs.com
Message-ID: <15a.1451dc81.2abb26a1@cs.com>
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:09:53 EDT
Subject: Re: [nas] Post from someone who calls himself OZ
To: crazo@tampabay.rr.com, nas@americakicks.com
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Too bad Oz will be very disappointed. He had already given it a name. Heard
of the "Short Corner?" He wanted to call this the "Tall Corner." :-)
Richie
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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>Too bad Oz will be very disappointed. He had already given it a name. Heard of the "Short Corner?" He wanted to call this the "Tall Corner." :-)
<BR>
<BR>Richie</FONT></HTML>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 06:32:52 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 06:33:58 -0700
Subject: [nas] Fire will stay in Naperville 2002-03
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 06:47:22 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 06:48:29 -0700
Subject: [nas] Twellman back to Germany ?
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/262/sports/Earning_power_for_Twellman+.sht
ml
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:01:45 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:02:06 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
Reply-to: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
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> I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are generally realistic at
> all, but they got lucky in this case and put us exactly where we
> belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be ranked #2 right now as it
> was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind Brazil in the rankings
> immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil by 3 goals. Mexico
> being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't be behind us.
Ok, well, I see. So, to you it is correct that the US is 8th, but it is not
correct that in the same ranking system that France is #2, or that Mexico is
ahead of the US and England is behind...
Hmm.. So you seem to have a lot of differing opinions on other teams in the
rankings, but NOT your home country's surprising rise to #8.... Fifa just
happen to get THAT one right in your opinion?
:) how convenient ( in my best 'churchlady')
peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:04:52 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:05:12 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] DCU v Dallas ESPN2 7:30 ET Preview
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
Reply-to: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
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> DCU needs to win to keep playoff hopes alive
> http://www.soccertimes.com/mls/2002/sep18.htm
There are more than a few of us that think that DALLAS needs to win to get
their crap together and not crash into the playoffs with five losses on the
trot...
peet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:11:13 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:12:02 -0400
To: nas@americakicks.com
From: Evan Whitney <Evan_Whitney@harvard.edu>
Subject: [nas] Very good article on Revs turnaround
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From Tom Hill, now at Revsnet:
http://revsnet.mlsfansites.com/story.php?news_ID=195&PHPSESSID=5c76248297d056b8f00e8c336e5dda2c
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:14:40 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:11:35 -0400
To: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>,
US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: [nas] Ronnie O'Brein
In-Reply-To: <009801c25fe5$92847920$6501a8c0@d0h9901>
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Anyone see how is the imported Ronnie O'Brein playing for the Burn these
days? Scored in his debut, but has he scored since
Is he the revelation that he was expected to be?
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 09:05 AM 9/19/02 -0500, Peter Welpton wrote:
> > DCU needs to win to keep playoff hopes alive
> > http://www.soccertimes.com/mls/2002/sep18.htm
>
>
>There are more than a few of us that think that DALLAS needs to win to get
>their crap together and not crash into the playoffs with five losses on the
>trot...
>
>
>peet
>
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:22:27 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 10:19:21 -0400
To: nas@americakicks.com
From: Niall Swan <nialls@rcn.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Very good article on Revs turnaround
In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20020919101010.01fed140@camail1.harvard.edu>
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Good article alright.
Stevie Nicol's first major lead coaching post - I hope he continues to turn
things around, but not at the Metrostars expense....!
The question is - will he do a better job than Mr Stapleton?!! :-)
Niall Swan
The Soccer Resort
www.soccerresort.com
Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 10:12 AM 9/19/02 -0400, Evan Whitney wrote:
> From Tom Hill, now at Revsnet:
>
>http://revsnet.mlsfansites.com/story.php?news_ID=195&PHPSESSID=5c76248297d0
>56b8f00e8c336e5dda2c
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 07:34:18 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 09:34:38 -0500
From: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Ronnie O'Brein
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
Reply-to: Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com>
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> Anyone see how is the imported Ronnie O'Brein playing for the Burn these
> days? Scored in his debut, but has he scored since
>
> Is he the revelation that he was expected to be?
Yes and No... Ronnie is in a tough spot in that his position is currently
filled by Joselito Vaca who has had a bit of a breakthrough this season.
Ronnie is still also working on his fitness and really gelling with the rest
of the team. So we have never really gotten a chance to see him go a full
90 more than a couple of times and one of those was a USOC match.
There is no doubt that Ronnie is a gamebreaker and in 2003 will more than
likely be a starter on a more regular basis. He has some of the most
impressive ball skills and ability to take on a defender in MLS.
But Burnfans have to be releived that finally, after 6.5 years the team has
depth at midfield in more than one position. In previous seasons when one
starter in the midfield went out, so did the team. Now, they can bring in a
few other people including Ronnie.
Remember, that in 2003 Dallas will be sporting Ronnie O'Brien and Chris
Gbandi as fresh new faces...
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:10:03 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:10:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Rochester/Richmond Preview
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Andy, Scott and I will be at the Richmond leg match so
their may by YCJ photos up later.
I don't have a vested interested in any team, but will
as the baseball song says, "Root root root for the
home team."
Cheers!
Kirsten
--- Mark Pallo <mpallo@rhinopit.com> wrote:
> Rochester Raging Rhinos at Richmond Kickers
> By Jerry Lindquist - Richmond Times Dispatch
>
http://www.timesdispatch.com/sports/localpros/kickers/MGBFSSD0A6D.html
>
> "They are under such intense scrutiny from fans and
> local media that
> losses aren't tolerated and even wins that don't
> measure up to certain
> standards can be subjected to ridicule. Eight
> regular-season losses this
> year drew considerable comment as six did a year ago
> and nine the
> previous campaign. Playing a defense-oriented style
> isn't the best way
> to win friends, either."
>
> "The pressure on him must be immense," said
> Cowlishaw, third-year coach
> of the Richmond Kickers, who meet the Rhinos for the
> Eastern Conference
> title in a two-game series starting tonight at
> Sports Backers Stadium.
> The Kickers are coming off a rousing
> come-from-behind decision over
> top-seeded Charleston in the second round.
>
> "[Ercoli] wins it year in and year out, and the fans
> are never happy,"
> Cowlishaw continued. "[The Rhinos] have mediocre
> regular seasons, and
> their fans say they're not good enough when people
> who really know
> what's going on realize that team can turn it on
> when needed - and it's
> more important to turn it on in the playoffs, which
> is what they've
> consistently done."
>
>
> Rhinos' foe Richmond still kicking
> By Jeff DiVeronica - Democrat and Chronicle
>
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/sports/rhinos/0919story1_rhinos.shtml
>
> -Mark
>
>
> ---
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=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:14:24 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:14:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] SJ v America (R)
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
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hmm, I'm suprised that either team played ANY of it's
stars, esp San Jose. Granted Donovan and 'Goos did not
play, but at least they drew a good crowd:
22,512 according to the Quakes.
Now how many were America fans or Mexicans cheering
for America and how many were true San Jose fans?
Just curious.
If LA and Chicago are any indication as far as crowds
for matches like this go, I'll bet the overwhelming
majority were rooting for the Mexican side.
Cheers!
Kirsten
vamanos America!
--- big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
> 1-1
>
http://sports.yahoo.com/m/sow/news/ap/20020919/ap-clubamerica-earthquakes.ht
> ml
>
> ---
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=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:20:20 2002
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From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] Twellman back to Germany ?
To: big_dog@fastmail.fm, NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
In-Reply-To: <B9AF23BD.B1D%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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I say this for everyone in the league:
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
We can't continue to lose our stars like this and
maintain cred as a league in the rest of the world.
The MLS needs to make sure they sign him to a sweet
multi-year deal, then sell or LOAN him in the off
season with the condition that he not be allowed to
join the Euro-side until Nov 1st or as soon as his
team drops out of playoff/USOC contention whichever
comes first. Then the MLS side can get him back on or
about June 1.
That's my opinion about DaBeas too. And any other
potential future stars. We cannot continue to be bled
like this and having the replacement be money draining
injury prone near retirement or should have retired
two years ago foreign stars.
That's my opinion and I'm stickin to it!
Kirsten
--- big_dog@fastmail.fm wrote:
>
http://www.boston.com/dailyglobe2/262/sports/Earning_power_for_Twellman+.sht
> ml
>
> ---
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> (http://www.americakicks.com)
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"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:29:07 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:29:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
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IMHO:
The numbers behind the rankings should have been
zero'ed out at the end of the World Cup. The rankings
at that point should have been the exact way they were
in the world Cup. THEN from there start pluggin in the
formulas for friendlies etc. The teams that did not
qualify for WC would be ranking all tied at one spot
below the last world cup ranking. Yes, I know Holland
could wipe the Saudi's butts all over the pitch, but
in this manner it would be fair and perhaps meaningful
when the rankings do come out in the post WC months.
If Holland wants to be higher than SA, then challenge
them to a friendly . . .
A coach's poll would be interesting too in addition to
this, but when I used to bet on pointy ball I never
put much stock in those things either.
Kirsten
--- Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com> wrote:
>
> > I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are
> generally realistic at
> > all, but they got lucky in this case and put us
> exactly where we
> > belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be
> ranked #2 right now as it
> > was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind
> Brazil in the rankings
> > immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil
> by 3 goals. Mexico
> > being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't
> be behind us.
>
>
> Ok, well, I see. So, to you it is correct that the
> US is 8th, but it is not
> correct that in the same ranking system that France
> is #2, or that Mexico is
> ahead of the US and England is behind...
>
> Hmm.. So you seem to have a lot of differing
> opinions on other teams in the
> rankings, but NOT your home country's surprising
> rise to #8.... Fifa just
> happen to get THAT one right in your opinion?
>
> :) how convenient ( in my best 'churchlady')
>
> peet
>
>
> ---
> NAS is hosted by America Kicks
> (http://www.americakicks.com)
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=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New DSL Internet Access from SBC & Yahoo!
http://sbc.yahoo.com
---
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:32:21 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:33:07 -0700
Subject: [nas] MLS Newlinks 9-19 (27 articles-more Fire bad news, Loney, Cassar,
playoffs, Gansler guarantee)
From: <big_dog@fastmail.fm>
To: NAS <NAS@americakicks.com>
Message-ID: <B9AF3C43.B32%big_dog@fastmail.fm>
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Rasov listed day to day with should seperation
http://espn.go.com/soccer/news/2001/0109/1004502.html
Down to the wire-All MLS teams alive heading into final weekend
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/mls_playoffs/
Metro's add Balboa, Cassar to roster
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/metros_moves_ap
Gansler: Recovered KC will make playoffs
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/kc0918gansler.html
Naperville wants Fire back
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/chi0918naperville.html
Fire add Selolwane
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/chi0918selolwane.html
Loney: Opening soon, the Loney academy
http://www.cybersoccernews.com/columnists/loney/020919loney.shtml
Fire will stay in Naperville 2002-03
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/fire_stadium
MLS Newsstand 09-19 (19)
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0919newsstand.html
-- Hurt Burn showing character (Fort Worth Star-Telegram)
-- Burn needs a win vs. D.C. United to hold 4th (Dallas Morning News)
-- Burn-D.C. United preview (Dallas Morning News)
-- Notebook: Playoff picture far from clear for Crew, MLS (Columbus
Dispatch)
-- Big name joins the game (Denver Post)
-- U.S. Ranking Is All-Time Best (Los Angeles Times)
-- Earning power for Twellman (Boston Globe)
-- Twellman points the way (Boston Herald)
-- United Must Keep Fingers Crossed (Washington Post)
-- United's Big Three could get broken up (Washington Times)
-- Alavanja treated, released after car wreck (Northern Virginia Journal)
-- Quakes tie at 'Stick (Oakland Tribune)
-- Unsatisfying exhibition draw (San Francisco Chronicle)
-- Saturday showdown looms for 'Quakes (Contra Costa Times)
-- Fervent fans enjoy soccer exhibition (San Jose Mercury News)
-- MetroStars add pair (New York Post)
-- No. 2 goalie Grafer on the spot (New York Daily News)
-- MetroStars' home for potential playoffs: Newark (Star-Ledger)
-- Good, bad and ugly (San Francisco Examiner)
--MS_Mac_OE_3115269187_252461_MIME_Part
Content-type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>MLS Newlinks 9-19 (27 articles-more Fire bad news, Loney, Cassar, pl=
ayoffs, Gansler guarantee)</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Rasov listed day to day with should seperation<BR>
http://espn.go.com/soccer/news/2001/0109/1004502.html<BR>
<BR>
Down to the wire-All MLS teams alive heading into final weekend<BR>
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/mls_playoffs/ <B=
R>
<BR>
Metro's add Balboa, Cassar to roster<BR>
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/metros_moves_ap =
<BR>
<BR>
Gansler: Recovered KC will make playoffs<BR>
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/kc0918gansler.html<BR>
<BR>
Naperville wants Fire back<BR>
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/chi0918naperville.html<BR>
<BR>
Fire add Selolwane<BR>
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/chi0918selolwane.html <BR>
<BR>
Loney: Opening soon, the Loney academy<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE>http://www.cybersoccernews.com/columnists/loney/020919loney.sht=
ml <BR>
<BR>
Fire will stay in Naperville 2002-03<BR>
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/us/news/2002/09/18/fire_stadium <BR=
>
<BR>
MLS Newsstand 09-19 (19)<BR>
http://www.mlsnet.com/content/02/mls0919newsstand.html<BR>
<FONT SIZE=3D"4"><B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Hurt Burn showing charact=
er </U></FONT>(Fort Worth Star-Telegram)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Burn needs a win vs. D.C. United to hold=
4th </U></FONT>(Dallas Morning News)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Burn-D.C. United preview </U></FONT>(Dal=
las Morning News)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Notebook: Playoff picture far from clear=
for Crew, MLS </U></FONT>(Columbus Dispatch)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Big name joins the game </U></FONT>(Denv=
er Post)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>U.S. Ranking Is All-Time Best </U></FONT=
>(Los Angeles Times)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#9D11B3"><U>Earning power for Twellman </U></FONT>(B=
oston Globe)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Twellman points the way </U></FONT>(Bost=
on Herald)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>United Must Keep Fingers Crossed </U></F=
ONT>(Washington Post)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>United's Big Three could get broken up <=
/U></FONT>(Washington Times)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Alavanja treated, released after car wre=
ck </U></FONT>(Northern Virginia Journal)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Quakes tie at 'Stick </U></FONT>(Oakland=
Tribune)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Unsatisfying exhibition draw </U></FONT>=
(San Francisco Chronicle)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Saturday showdown looms for 'Quakes </U>=
</FONT>(Contra Costa Times)<BR>
</FONT><FONT SIZE=3D"5">-</FONT><FONT SIZE=3D"4"><B>-</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"=
><U>Fervent fans enjoy soccer exhibition </U></FONT>(San Jose Mercury News)<=
BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>MetroStars add pair </U></FONT>(New York=
Post)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>No. 2 goalie Grafer on the spot </U></FO=
NT>(New York Daily News)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>MetroStars' home for potential playoffs:=
Newark </U></FONT>(Star-Ledger)<BR>
<B>--</B> <FONT COLOR=3D"#0000FF"><U>Good, bad and ugly </U></FONT>(San Franc=
isco Examiner)<BR>
</FONT><FONT SIZE=3D"5"><BR>
</FONT><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BODY>
</HTML>
--MS_Mac_OE_3115269187_252461_MIME_Part--
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 08:47:15 2002
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Reply-To: <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
From: "Timothy D. Ristorcelli" <crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
To: "NAS" <nas@americakicks.com>
Subject: [nas] US Soccer News Links 09-19-02
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 11:47:59 -0400
Message-ID: <NFBBIPKNNAKPKDLEMCLEAECDCDAA.crazo@tampabay.rr.com>
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US Soccer News Links 09-19-02
http://www.sams-army.com/index.php/Mlist=news/Nyear=2002/Nmonth=09/Nday=19
____________________________________
Timothy D. Ristorcelli, MBA
crazo@tampabay.rr.com
Check out: http://www.sams-army.com
ICQ: 1361610
____________________________________
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 09:50:49 2002
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From: AbraRob@aol.com
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 12:50:54 EDT
Subject: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
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METROSTARS TO HOST ALL 2002 MLS PLAYOFF
GAMES AT RIVERFRONT STADIUM IN NEWARK
SECAUCUS, NJ (September 19, 2002) - MetroStars President/General Manager
Nick Sakiewicz announced today that the team will host all of its potential
2002 MLS Cup playoff home games at intimate Riverfront Stadium in Newark,
NJ, should the MetroStars clinch their third straight postseason berth this
weekend in New England.
Giants Stadium, where the MetroStars have played all of their regular season
and playoff home games over their seven-year history, is unavailable to the
team for the first four potential 2002 playoff game dates (September 25, 26,
28 and 29) due to scheduling conflicts.
Bears and Eagles Riverfront Stadium, located directly off of Route 280 and
within a 50-yard walk of New Jersey Transit's Broad Street rail station, is
a state-of-the-art ballpark built in 1999 for minor league baseball's Newark
Bears. The stadium, configured to seat 6,200 fans for baseball, will be
temporarily reconfigured for the MetroStars to accommodate more than 8,500
fans, and possibly more, during the team's drive for the 2002 MLS Cup.
"While we would love to play our playoff games in the stadium where we have
played every one of our home games during our franchise's history, it is
unfortunately not an option we have," said Sakiewicz. "That being said, we
are absolutely thrilled to be able to bring our most important games of the
year into Riverfront Stadium and the city of Newark, which is not only a
hotbed of MetroStars supporters but is also incredibly easy to get to not
only by car but by various methods of mass transit.
"And on top of it all, we get the incredible, intimate atmosphere of
Riverfront Stadium, which should provide us with the perfect environment as
we try to bring home the MLS Cup."
Advance tickets for each MetroStars playoff game at Riverfront Stadium will
go on sale this Monday. All advance tickets will cost $25, and are available
by calling 1-888-4-METROTIX, the Newark Bears ticket line at 973-483-6900,
and at the Riverfront Stadium box office at 450 Broad Street in Newark. All
fans purchasing advance tickets through the MetroStars at 1-888-4-METROTIX
will also receive a Burger King value voucher, good for one free value meal
(sandwich, fries, soft drink), with each advance ticket purchased.
Advance tickets are also available at all local Ticketmaster outlets.
Tickets for all seats purchased on the day of the game or games, if
available, will cost $30.
As part of their season ticket package, all MetroMember season ticket
holders will receive the same number of seats that they own at Giants
Stadium at no additional charge for games at Riverfront Stadium. The
MetroStars will make every possible effort to relocate the seats of season
ticket holders in the best possible similar locations at Riverfront, though
the small confines of the park give every seat a great vantage point of the
playing field.
The MetroStars are currently in a three-way tie for sixth place in the MLS
Cup playoff race, with five teams vying for the final three spots in the
eight-team playoff race. The MetroStars (35 points) need only a tie on
Saturday to clinch their third straight playoff spot, and could know even
before game-time against New England (35 points) whether they have qualified
or not provided D.C. United (32 points) loses or ties tonight against
Dallas, along with Kansas City (35 points) losing at Colorado on Friday
night.
The MetroStars own the head-to-head, season-series tiebreaker edges over
both Kansas City (1-0-1) and New England (3-0-0 so far).
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 09:56:46 2002
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From: Jason Benfield <Jason.Benfield@genband.com>
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: RE: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 11:56:49 -0500
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Are you kidding me? Attendance last week and the week before was really
impressive for the League, but to have this happen is certainly a blow to
the league. The metros need to get the hell out of giants stadium.
-----Original Message-----
From: AbraRob@aol.com [mailto:AbraRob@aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 11:51 AM
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
METROSTARS TO HOST ALL 2002 MLS PLAYOFF
GAMES AT RIVERFRONT STADIUM IN NEWARK
SECAUCUS, NJ (September 19, 2002) - MetroStars President/General Manager
Nick Sakiewicz announced today that the team will host all of its potential
2002 MLS Cup playoff home games at intimate Riverfront Stadium in Newark,
NJ, should the MetroStars clinch their third straight postseason berth this
weekend in New England.
Giants Stadium, where the MetroStars have played all of their regular season
and playoff home games over their seven-year history, is unavailable to the
team for the first four potential 2002 playoff game dates (September 25, 26,
28 and 29) due to scheduling conflicts.
Bears and Eagles Riverfront Stadium, located directly off of Route 280 and
within a 50-yard walk of New Jersey Transit's Broad Street rail station, is
a state-of-the-art ballpark built in 1999 for minor league baseball's Newark
Bears. The stadium, configured to seat 6,200 fans for baseball, will be
temporarily reconfigured for the MetroStars to accommodate more than 8,500
fans, and possibly more, during the team's drive for the 2002 MLS Cup.
"While we would love to play our playoff games in the stadium where we have
played every one of our home games during our franchise's history, it is
unfortunately not an option we have," said Sakiewicz. "That being said, we
are absolutely thrilled to be able to bring our most important games of the
year into Riverfront Stadium and the city of Newark, which is not only a
hotbed of MetroStars supporters but is also incredibly easy to get to not
only by car but by various methods of mass transit.
"And on top of it all, we get the incredible, intimate atmosphere of
Riverfront Stadium, which should provide us with the perfect environment as
we try to bring home the MLS Cup."
Advance tickets for each MetroStars playoff game at Riverfront Stadium will
go on sale this Monday. All advance tickets will cost $25, and are available
by calling 1-888-4-METROTIX, the Newark Bears ticket line at 973-483-6900,
and at the Riverfront Stadium box office at 450 Broad Street in Newark. All
fans purchasing advance tickets through the MetroStars at 1-888-4-METROTIX
will also receive a Burger King value voucher, good for one free value meal
(sandwich, fries, soft drink), with each advance ticket purchased.
Advance tickets are also available at all local Ticketmaster outlets.
Tickets for all seats purchased on the day of the game or games, if
available, will cost $30.
As part of their season ticket package, all MetroMember season ticket
holders will receive the same number of seats that they own at Giants
Stadium at no additional charge for games at Riverfront Stadium. The
MetroStars will make every possible effort to relocate the seats of season
ticket holders in the best possible similar locations at Riverfront, though
the small confines of the park give every seat a great vantage point of the
playing field.
The MetroStars are currently in a three-way tie for sixth place in the MLS
Cup playoff race, with five teams vying for the final three spots in the
eight-team playoff race. The MetroStars (35 points) need only a tie on
Saturday to clinch their third straight playoff spot, and could know even
before game-time against New England (35 points) whether they have qualified
or not provided D.C. United (32 points) loses or ties tonight against
Dallas, along with Kansas City (35 points) losing at Colorado on Friday
night.
The MetroStars own the head-to-head, season-series tiebreaker edges over
both Kansas City (1-0-1) and New England (3-0-0 so far).
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From: "Backslider ." <backslider@hotmail.com>
To: nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA rankings
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 13:44:48 -0400
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What purpose would that serve? If people wanted to know the standings of
the World Cup, they could look it up on the FIFA web site. Having a
"ranking" that simply reflected the results of one tournament (even the
World Cup) is pointless.
The purpose of a ranking system, imo, should be to indicate which team is
better than which other team. I would define better as "expected to win a
majority of the time". The fact that we beat Spain in the World Cup is a
very useful data point. But it doesn't determine if we're better, by my
definition. The question is "Would the US beat Spain a majority of the time
(given current rosters, etc.)?" If the answer is no, then we should be
ranked lower than Spain.
Backslider
>From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
>To: US Soccer List <nas@americakicks.com>
>Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFA
>rankings
>Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 08:29:16 -0700 (PDT)
>
>IMHO:
>The numbers behind the rankings should have been
>zero'ed out at the end of the World Cup. The rankings
>at that point should have been the exact way they were
>in the world Cup. THEN from there start pluggin in the
>formulas for friendlies etc. The teams that did not
>qualify for WC would be ranking all tied at one spot
>below the last world cup ranking. Yes, I know Holland
>could wipe the Saudi's butts all over the pitch, but
>in this manner it would be fair and perhaps meaningful
>when the rankings do come out in the post WC months.
>If Holland wants to be higher than SA, then challenge
>them to a friendly . . .
>
>A coach's poll would be interesting too in addition to
>this, but when I used to bet on pointy ball I never
>put much stock in those things either.
>
>Kirsten
>--- Peter Welpton <peter@lexandterry.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I definitely don't think the FIFA rankings are
> > generally realistic at
> > > all, but they got lucky in this case and put us
> > exactly where we
> > > belong. It is as ridiculous for France to be
> > ranked #2 right now as it
> > > was ridiculous for them to be ranked #2 behind
> > Brazil in the rankings
> > > immediately after they won WC98 by beating Brazil
> > by 3 goals. Mexico
> > > being ahead of us is silly, but England shouldn't
> > be behind us.
> >
> >
> > Ok, well, I see. So, to you it is correct that the
> > US is 8th, but it is not
> > correct that in the same ranking system that France
> > is #2, or that Mexico is
> > ahead of the US and England is behind...
> >
> > Hmm.. So you seem to have a lot of differing
> > opinions on other teams in the
> > rankings, but NOT your home country's surprising
> > rise to #8.... Fifa just
> > happen to get THAT one right in your opinion?
> >
> > :) how convenient ( in my best 'churchlady')
> >
> > peet
> >
> >
> > ---
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>
>=====
>"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago
>re Section 8.
>
>"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For
>everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
> --- Leon Daudet
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 11:13:31 2002
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From: Mike Babyak <mbabyak@duke.edu>
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To: Jason Benfield <Jason.Benfield@genband.com>
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Subject: RE: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
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On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, Jason Benfield wrote:
> Are you kidding me? Attendance last week and the week before was really
> impressive for the League, but to have this happen is certainly a blow to
> the league.
Assuming, of course, they actually make the playoffs, which I doubt.
Mike Babyak
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 11:34:25 2002
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 11:34:34 -0700 (PDT)
From: Kirsten Tautfest <hori_too@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
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I hope they learn to appreciate the intimate
atmosphere that a small stadium can bring -- and a
potential for prematch sellouts! :)
But first, they have to get there. :p
--- AbraRob@aol.com wrote:
> METROSTARS TO HOST ALL 2002 MLS PLAYOFF
> GAMES AT RIVERFRONT STADIUM IN NEWARK
>
=====
"We are loud. We are proud. We are from Chicago." - myself on Wild Chicago re Section 8.
"Playing with fire is bad for those who end up burning themselves. For everyone else, it's a great pleasure."
--- Leon Daudet
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 11:37:41 2002
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From: "Chris Allen" <csallen@charter.net>
To: nas@americakicks.com
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 14:36:30 -0400
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Subject: RE: [nas] And the MetroStars new playoff home is....
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On 19 Sep 2002 at 11:56, Jason Benfield wrote:
> Are you kidding me? Attendance last week and the week before was really
> impressive for the League, but to have this happen is certainly a blow to
> the league. The metros need to get the hell out of giants stadium.
Maybe the "best" solution to this problem is for the Metros to not make
the playoffs this year. :-)
Go Revs!
Chris Allen
csallen@charter.net
http://webpages.charter.net/csallen/soccer.htm
-
"Comrades, we always said it was a 5 year plan"
--NE Rev Fanzine "Pictures of Chairman Mao (1996-2001)
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 12:09:13 2002
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From: "mrmoore01@prodigy.net" <mrmoore01@prodigy.net>
To: grattonp@unlv.edu, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental? (or has Zambrano?)
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:09:21 -0400
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But whom? =20
I do not think it would happen, but a perfect guy to=20
lead that rather volatile group, would be Yeadley
at Indiana=2E =20
I just know, short of a few mil, he likley would never
leave the comfy confines of IU=2E
Bring Back Bruce Arena?????
Jeff
Original Message:
-----------------
From: PETER V GRATTON grattonp@unlv=2Eedu
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 07:59:01 -0700 (PDT)
To: nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: Re: [nas] Mathis Gone Mental? (or has Zambrano?)
However as several people have pointed out the TEAM is cracked apart and
a NEW Coach is the Only solution short of wholesale trades=2E=20
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Sep 19 12:11:26 2002
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From: "mrmoore01@prodigy.net" <mrmoore01@prodigy.net>
To: nialls@rcn.com, peter@lexandterry.com, nas@americakicks.com
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFArankings
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2002 15:11:34 -0400
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These things are just this: coffee table fodder
for banter like what we are engaged in=2E
If that is what we use them for- then fine=2E
If we take them very seriously, we can be committed ;-)
Jeff
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Niall Swan nialls@rcn=2Ecom
Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 11:08:52 -0400
To: peter@lexandterry=2Ecom, nas@americakicks=2Ecom
Subject: Re: [nas] US Men rise to eighth inthe world in latest FIFAranking=
s
Hmm - Holland and Spain are quite high given their history of=20
underachievement Holland did not even qualify for the world cup=2E Austral=
ia=20
is ranked 17 ahead of the US=2E Ok a major boob there=2E It's seems in ter=
ms of=20
which one is better, that it's six of one, and half a dozen of the other!
Niall
The Soccer Resort
www=2Esoccerresort=2Ecom
Adult Soccer Vacations in the Sun
At 10:05 AM 9/18/02 -0500, you wrote:
> >
http://sports=2Eyahoo=2Ecom/m/world/news/reuters/20020918/reu-rankingsdc=2E=
html
>
>
>OK, we had a major debate about the reality of this thing not too long ag=
o=2E
>
>Can anyone really defend this? Come on, EIGHTH? Over England and Italy?=
>
>Now, if you remember, I am a supporter of the Elo Ranking system that
>currently has the US at 19th=2E http://www=2Eeloratings=2Enet
>
>While not perfect, a much more accurate picture of International Football=
=2E
>
>let the overly exhaustive and debated thread BEGIN!!
>
>peet
>
>
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To post, send an email to nas@americakicks.comFrom <nas-owner@americakicks.com> Thu Se